Mark my words:
Trump will win, and it will be largely because of people who refuse to support Biden due to Palestine.
I will be truly happy if time proves me wrong.
this post was submitted on 24 Jan 2024
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We should be criticizing our old, conservative president Biden. He needs to 180 his stance.
Also not voting for him in Nov is vapid and invalidates any defense of the Palestinian people you have.
It sucks, but it's reality.
It sucks, but it’s reality.
Yep.
We legitimately have zero options besides voting for Biden.
And I sincerely hope enough voters realize that, because trump will be worse.
The only thing we can do till 2028 is make a lot of noise about how this shit is unacceptable and Dems need to do better
Unfortunately the DNC knows that while we say it's unacceptable, we still have to vote Biden or risk trump.
Which is why the DNC has spent 30 years drifting further and further right. They have captive voters and are willing to risk Republican rule so Dems can be as rightwing as possible.
This is honestly the best take on the issue I've seen so far.
I am the first person to say we need to break the two-party stranglehold on politics. We need independent candidates in office yesterday. But this election is the abso-fucking-lutely worst time to make a run at that, because that third party vote WILL be a vote for Trump. And if you firmly believe that third party or independent politicians have a place, elect them to your local city council or school board or state legislature. That is where they will make a real, actionable difference.
A vote against Biden, no matter who for, is a vote for Trump. No amount of TikTok "well ackshually" will change that reality.
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Then you better start pushing your party to primary him or get someone else in there. His shitty numbers didnt start overnight, theyve seen the writing on the wall and refused to acknowledge it.
Biden's arrogance on this is incredible, though of course he's part of the party establishment so that's to be expected. "You aren't allowed to complain about anything and if we don't win this election it's all your fault" is not, it turns out, a winning campaign slogan.
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Eventhough Trump moved the embassy to Jerusalem and supports the complete destruction of gaza
They don't care.
The people pledging to vote against Biden over Israel are typically armchair politicians who get all their news from echo chambers. Facts and reality don't matter; they honestly believe they are "sending a message" and "making a stand". The reality is that they're the 2024 version of 2016's insufferable #voteswap techbros.
Those people don't vote. People are either undecided until the election or already decided. I could fill out the ballot right now.
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And then Trump will make things infinitely worse, and we'll have to fight that same stupid battle over who's to blame for the next 4 years. Wash, rinse, repeat.
Yes indeed, but the people pledging to vote against Biden because Israel don't care. Or don't believe. Or sincerely think Trump will be better.
Or they don't want to vote for a pro genocide President. Tbh, I get it. Your vote is your stamp of approval for a candidate for a lot of people. It's the only way to say their approval that a lot of people have, their only voice.
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Yeah, I don't understand hating Biden for something that Netanyahu is doing. And there's only so much Biden could do other than try to play peacekeeper, which he's been doing. Pretty much any other actions require congressional support. Biden isn't a king, he can't unilaterally declare that we're ending all support for Israel.
And yet an insane number of people act like he's over there killing Palestinians with his bare hands.
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Weird way to assign blame. It's not the Democratic party's fault for having bad policies, it's the public's fault for not supporting the Democrats regardless of their policies. If Biden loses it's because his party made bad decisions.
It's just how liberal centrists sheild themselves from self-reflection. They know there are people to their left, and engaging with their ideas might make them realize their policies and candidates cause harm, so they decide to dismiss them out of hand as aiding the right. This creates a safe narrative where they're always the good guy; people to their right are dangerous lunatics, people to their left are naive fools who are unintentionally helping the lunatics, and they're the only ones behaving responsibly. This allows them to condemn people calling for the end of a genocide without engaging with the fact that their candidate is enabling a genocide.
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When did lemmy become such a shithole? I know people here tend to be young, but I thought they were generally more intelligent than this shit. So much "genocide Joe" bullshit. People that will refuse to vote, and then completely absolve themselves when they hand it to Trump and the genocide escalates.
It's not about Palestinian lives, it's about making sure you don't feel guilty for personally voting for Joe Biden.
Grow the fuck up
It’s just idiots, can’t escape them. Not on Reddit, not on Lemmy, and not when it comes to deciding our shared fate via elections. And I assume some portion of the “genocide Joe” crowd are just plants.
You can demand better from your elected officials, while continuing to vote for them. Joe is a horrible democrat candidate, and I have zero qualms about making that known. But he’s also the only candidate the party has been willing to put forth, so it’s who I’ll end up voting for. That doesn’t mean I need to be happy or enthusiastic about voting for him.
Biden is actively giving money to a genocidal state, I'm still going to vote for him because the only other choice is a literal fascist who wants to start genocides here as well.
I don't think it's that simple, especially for people of colour, and especially for those with Arab and especially Palestinian heritage.
America hasn't been great to us ever. Since 2001 it has gotten distinctly worse for us.
A lot of us have family who are being or have been bombed by the US indiscriminately. The US and Joe Biden is funding a genocide. That's not made up. That's not a joke. The US is more upset that the Houthis raised global shipping by a couple percent than they are that the ally that they give the most money to has killed north of 25000 defenseless people in three months.
I agree that voting for trump is going to make it worse for everyone, which is why I will still vote for Biden. But I voted begrudgingly for him last time, because I knew he was fake, and not really liberal. He hasn't stood by a single campaign promise he made. If a legitimate, liberal, left wing third party came up, I would vote for them immediately. Choosing between one racist piece of shit and a more racist, more orange piece of shit is not a great choice.
Again, I agree that trump would be a million times worse for brown and black people. But I get why a lot of Arab Americans and black Americans are fucking tired of it, and want to make a point to the DNC. That same party that is not a left wing party or a liberal party, that is completely bought out by corporations (ex. See how they fucked Bernie in 2016), and that will turn around and blame brown and black voters for not delivering them the white house when literally over half.of white women and white men want Donald Trump.
A lot of the people I've spoken to now are done. This was never really our country and politicians have made it even more obvious that it isn't. So the idea that a lot of people have now is "well fuck it, why should we vote to save this country when the people who run this country keep.fucking it up and especially fucking us over. It's time for whitey to do his/her part if they actually care, and if they don't fuck it, we will leave"
It's not about growing up, it's about being tired of being second or third class citizens. The only reason this is getting such a big shout-out now is because the policies are finally starting to affect white people, white women in particular. And yet somehow.still over half of them want trump in.
He hasn’t stood by a single campaign promise he made
Honestly, if you think he hasn't fulfilled any of his promises it's because you don't want to acknowledge his attempts and those who are standing in the way.
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So much “genocide Joe” bullshit. People that will refuse to vote, and then completely absolve themselves when they hand it to Trump and the genocide escalates.
One can literally hate Joe Biden, and still continue to vote for Joe Biden. If I am in the position of voting for democratic candidates that aren't funded by AIPAC, and is willing to be critical against Israel, I'd vote for them unless forced to (the other candidate is a Republican.). I think the responsible thing to do is to continue criticizing the decision to support Israel, as well as their action, reject Hamas, vote for democratic candidates and try picking the ones that aren't paid for by the AIPAC.
- Signed, a millenial Lemming.
Ok, protesting and poking Joe with a stick is not the same as refusing to vote for him in the general election.
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They repeatedly stopped Biden, who appeared frustrated at times, with chants that included "Genocide Joe" and "How many kids will you kill?" in opposition to his support for Israel in its war against Hamas in Gaza.
Biden supporters drowned them out the protesters with chants of "four more years" and "let's go, Joe."
He struggled to finish his speech, telling the crowd at one point, "They feel deeply."
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Liberals will still blame his (and Hillary Clinton's) critics instead of the democrats' bad policies and hubris for electing Donald Trump even though those same liberals still talk, think and act like republicans and willing just as much to throw the handicapped, the queer, the women and the racial minorities under the bus all just for neo-liberal policies that are not too different from Trump's.
speaking of, much of what was done against abortion was not reversed and is destined to keep being dangled above those liberals' head, and then they'll say we shouldn't criticize the holy neo liberal savior so he could reverse Trump's clownery just for this to go all over again.
Free Women, Free Ukraine, Free Palestine (from Hamas AND Israel), Free America (from Trump)
It's true for all of us if we pay tax.
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