this post was submitted on 14 Mar 2024
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Rep. Ilhan Omar (D-Minn.) said policy differences toward Israel between her and President Biden won’t stop her from supporting him in the November general election.

“Of course,” Omar said Tuesday, when asked by CNN’s Abby Phillip on “NewsNight” whether she would vote for Biden if the election were held that day, in a clip highlighted by Mediaite. “Democracy is on the line, we are facing down fascism.”

“And I personally know what my life felt like having Trump as the president of this country, and I know what it felt like for my constituents, and for people around this country and around the world,” Omar continued. “We have to do everything that we can to make sure that does not happen to our country again.”

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[–] yarr@feddit.nl 5 points 9 months ago (1 children)

But we deserve better than either option.

You can deserve all you want, but that won't change the names on the ballot. If you really care, start organizing some grassroots support around 3rd parties, or perhaps take on a role in government in your local jurisdiction. The upcoming election is 99.999% going to be between Trump and Biden. Vote or not, there's very little you can do about alternatives at this point. Start working on the next one.

[–] givesomefucks@lemmy.world -1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Man, if only we had an earlier election where we have a say in who the general candidate was....

But I'm sure if Biden doesn't move left and trump wins, you're going to do the rational thing and blame Biden and his campaign team for their words and actions.

I mean, it would be ridiculous if instead you blamed all the people who held their nose and voted D but spent 4 years telling everyone that Biden isn't popular enough to beat trump again. And he needs to do more to reach out to Dem voters.

[–] Natanael@slrpnk.net -2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

https://www.axios.com/2024/03/14/us-settler-sanctions-west-bank

The U.S. Department of Treasury announced new sanctions Thursday against two illegal outposts in the occupied West Bank that were used as a base for attacks by extremist Israeli settlers against Palestinian civilians, three U.S. officials told Axios.

Why it matters: It is the first time U.S. sanctions are being imposed against entire outposts and not just against individuals.

The move comes as the Biden administration ratchets up pressure on the government of Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu over a range of issues, including settler violence against Palestinians and the war in Gaza. There were nearly 500 Israeli settler attacks against Palestinians between Oct. 7 and Jan. 31 of this year, according to the UN humanitarian office (OCHA).

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/trump-israel-gaza-finish-problem-rcna141905

PALM BEACH, Fla. — Former President Donald Trump declared Tuesday that Israel must “finish the problem” in its war against Hamas, his most definitive position on the conflict since the terror group killed 1,200 Israelis and took more than 200 hostages on Oct. 7.

That month, his campaign also said that, if elected again, he would bar Gaza residents from entering the U.S. as part of an expanded travel ban.

Is this good enough for you?

[–] givesomefucks@lemmy.world -1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Flashback: On Feb. 1, President Biden signed an executive order allowing the U.S. to impose new sanctions on Israeli settlers — and potentially Israeli politicians and government officials — involved in violent attacks against Palestinians in the West Bank.

I remember when Biden sanctioned the few individuals....

Even a comment I made back then, but it would be a hassle to find it.

I said it was better than nothing, and if Biden actually sanctioned the politicians and government officials behind this shit, I'd unironically stand up and clap.

But that sanctioning random settlers literally accomplishs nothing. So I dont know why people want to brag about it.

I still dont know why someone would act like this means anything, and I'm still desperately waiting for the chance to be proud of Biden.

[–] Natanael@slrpnk.net 0 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

He's doing a lot of diplomacy behind closed doors, a bit too much for my taste even, but that's how he's always worked and he'll keep doing that, so there's not much visible but the few public statements. I think he needs to do more, but he's very risk averse and the problem is that if he just straight up blocks all support for Israel then that could cause chaos (risk for war in the region, loss of internal support, etc).

[–] givesomefucks@lemmy.world 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

but he’s very risk averse

If he was averse to risk, he'd stop doing all this shit his voters hate less than a year out from an election...

He's being dangerously risky right now, and we're all fucked if it turns out he made a bad judgement call and loses the election.

he just straight up blocks all support for Israel then that could cause chaos (risk for war in the region, loss of internal support, etc).

At the same time, Biden says trump is incredibly dangerous, and him becoming president again could be the end of American democracy.

And I agree with that.

Which is why I think Biden putting Israel over America is so fucking stupid.

America isn't responsible for the safety of Israel. If America stopped protecting them at the UN, and the UN forced them to stop their genocide...

That wouldn't be the end of Israel, just the end of their current genocide.

If Israel got attacked after that and invaded, then aid to Israel would be a different story and the rest of the UN would be helping.

You're arguing from this false stance where Joe Biden is the only thing keeping Israel a state right now, and ignoring that his support of Israel could very well lead to the actual end of American democracy.

The president of America's priority should be America, not if a foreign country might have to stop their genocide.

Like, if Biden was stopping a genocide, that would be different.

Do you legitimately not understand any of that?

[–] Cryophilia@lemmy.world 5 points 9 months ago (2 children)

he’d stop doing all this shit his voters hate less than a year out from an election…

There's not as many people who think like you as you think there are.

[–] jumjummy@lemmy.world 3 points 9 months ago

And unfortunately it’s mostly younger voters, who as a group BARELY vote.

[–] juicy@lemmy.today 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

We have states with 20% of voters choosing uncommitted. What are you on about?

[–] Cryophilia@lemmy.world 2 points 9 months ago (2 children)

80% > 20%

And that's of Democrats who voted in the primary.

There's just way more supporters of Israel than there are people who dislike genocide. Biden has to be careful to not lose their votes.

[–] juicy@lemmy.today 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

You can't assume the 80% of people who voted for Biden would abandon him the minute he withdrew his support of genocide. They might as easily believe the fud I keep hearing here that an uncommitted vote is tantamount to a vote for Trump.

[–] Cryophilia@lemmy.world 1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Likewise, not all of the 20% would withold their votes if he continues to support Israel.

But regardless of the actual number, it's pretty clear that "votes at risk if I continue to support Israel" is a much smaller number than "votes at risk if I denounce Israel". The resulting political calculus is unavoidable. Biden can work for a ceasefire, but acting or speaking in direct opposition to Israel is a terrible idea.

[–] juicy@lemmy.today 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

It's not clear at all that a smaller number of votes are at risk. And the whole idea that whether Biden supports genocide should the result of a political calculus is abhorrent.

[–] Cryophilia@lemmy.world 1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

That's life, if you can't handle it go get therapy or something. "Stop all bad things" is not always an option, you have to pick the least bad sometimes.

[–] juicy@lemmy.today -1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

No matter how many mental gymnastics you do, you are still voting for genocide if you vote for Joe Biden.

[–] Cryophilia@lemmy.world 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

You're voting for genocide no matter what. You're just voting to genocide harder if you do anything other than vote for Biden.

[–] federatingIsTooHard@lemmy.world -1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

voting for Jill Stein or Cornel West or de la Cruz are votes against genocide

[–] Cryophilia@lemmy.world 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Nah, that's splitting the Biden vote. Which is helping Trump. Which is a vote in favor of even more genocide.

[–] federatingIsTooHard@lemmy.world 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

only a vote for trump is a vote for trump. a vote for any other candidate is a vote against trump

[–] Cryophilia@lemmy.world 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Not in a winner take all system. That's not how voting works in the US.

[–] federatingIsTooHard@lemmy.world -1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

this is just misinformation. this is exactly how voting works in the us.

[–] Cryophilia@lemmy.world 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Literally not even true. There can be only one President, and the party that gets the most votes wins. It's very easy math if you're interested in truth. Which you are not.

[–] federatingIsTooHard@lemmy.world -1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

nothing you said contradicts what I said except "literally not even true" which isn't an argument.

[–] Cryophilia@lemmy.world 0 points 9 months ago
[–] bigMouthCommie@kolektiva.social 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I was under the impression that refusing to do the right thing because you’re scared of the consequences was the definition of cowardice.

[–] Cryophilia@lemmy.world 1 points 9 months ago (3 children)

You're a troll, please go away.

[–] bigMouthCommie@kolektiva.social 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

calling me names doesn't change whether what i said was true.

[–] Cryophilia@lemmy.world 1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

You're a troll, please go away.

[–] juicy@lemmy.today 0 points 9 months ago

Yes, the ad hominem attack has been famous for its effectiveness since Ancient Greece. The key is to start by engaging with a comment you disagree with using logic. But when you run out of reasoned responses and they think they've cornered you, call them a name or insult their mother. 99% of the time it works every time.