There is certainly room for more direct assistance to Ukraine. Easy examples include establishing air supremacy over the country and performing airstrikes on invaders inside Ukraine.
this post was submitted on 23 Jun 2025
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Do note that "establishing a no-fly zone" means you'll need planes over the border. Which means you'll need to bomb the shit out of every AA missile in Russia. Which means you'll need to destroy every airfield as well, because their planes will defend their AA missile launchers.
I mean, I'm all for it, but it's important to note that the Libya no-fly zone was established mostly through bombing the shit out of Libya, not through air-to-air engagements. Russia will be worse.
I don't get it, didn't Russia do exactly what the US is doing a preventive bombarding? Is today opposite day?
You do realise Iran is direclty supplying weapons to Russia that are used against Ukraine. Did you really expect for Ukraine to side with Iran here? It seems a lot of people are forgetting what a shitty country Iran actually is ...
Israel also supplied Drones to Russia after the Crimea invasion, didn't join sanctions and as reported by an Ukrainian official demanded Ukraine to surrender behind closed doors.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel%E2%80%93Russia_relations
Now with the US getting itself dragged into another Iraq style war by Israel, Ukraine could suffer in two major ways:
- Western military aid will be cut short in favor of Israel and US
- The rising energy prices will lead to Russia's strained warchest to replenish and could even lead to EU countries easing sanctions to buy oil and gas from Russia again.
Ukraine is being played by the US and Israel but either plays along because Zelensky is high on Zionism or because Ukraine by now is owned by the US and he has to say everything Trump wants him to say. Either way this is bad for the Ukrainian people and it is delusional to think that anyone in the West would feel emboldened now to bomb Russia.
Zelensky is high on Zionism, wtf does that imply?
Zelensky seems to be an ardent supporter of Israel and by extension its grave breaches of international law and humanitarian law. For Zelensky it seems that Israel is the victim as it carries out ethnic cleansing, occupation and Apartheid.
By siding with the oppressor he undermines the legitimacy of Ukraines rightful call against oppression and violation of international law. As Zelensky is undermining his owns countries position it seems that he is ideologically Zionist.
Now he has sided with the attackers again, which undermines his and Ukraines position even further. The question is: Is Israel more important to Zelensky than the rules under which Ukraine is protected from Russias aggression?
https://www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/russia-ukraine-war-israel-palestine-zelensky-support-disgrace
A 'big Israel'
The Israeli vote at the UN followed hot on the heels of Zelensky making a statement promoting Israel as a model for post-war Ukraine. He said his country would become a "big Israel," with the armed forces having a strong presence in every aspect of Ukrainian society.
He observed that in "all institutions, supermarkets, cinemas, there will be people with weapons". For the foreseeable future, Ukraine would develop as a highly militarised society like Israel rather than being "absolutely liberal, European". Almost as an afterthought, he added that Ukraine would avoid becoming "authoritarian". Dear President Zelensky, your support for Israel is a disgrace Read More »
The cosying up to Israel began some time ago under Zelensky. In 2020, he delighted Israel by pulling Ukraine out of a UN committee established in 1975 "to enable Palestinian people to exercise... the right to self-determination... the right to national independence and sovereignty, and the right to return to their homes and property from which they have been displaced".
But the significance of modelling a future Ukraine on Israel is being largely ignored.
Israel is highly militarised because, as a settler-colonial state trying to dispossess and replace the native population, it must treat the Palestinians as an enemy that needs either to be beaten into submission or expelled.
For decades, the Israeli army and settler militias have worked hand in hand to drive Palestinians off their land (ethnic cleansing) and keep them ghettoised and away from the exclusively Jewish communities built in their place (apartheid). Is this what Zelensky intends for Ukraine: a deeply segregated society where the Ukrainian army and militias drive out those seen as not truly Ukrainian?
https://www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/russia-ukraine-war-israel-palestine-zelensky-support-disgrace
You said: "We are in different countries and in completely different conditions. But the threat is the same: for both us and you – the total destruction of the people, state, culture. And even of the names: Ukraine, Israel."
I am angry and sad that Russia is seeking to occupy your country and to crush the rights of the Ukrainian people to self-determination and freedom, and I believe that every possible support must be given to Ukrainians as they resist this barbaric aggression. At the same time, I reject the policies of the US and its Nato allies around the globe.
....
Since the start of Russia’s offensive against your country, you have continued to practice double standards. While Israel has hesitated to accept non-Jewish Ukrainian refugees fleeing the Russian bombing - a policy motivated by inhumanity and ethnic supremacism, with which Palestinians are all too familiar - you remain willing to turn to Israel’s right-wing nationalist prime minister, Naftali Bennett, as a mediator.
I know that most Palestinians are watching your stubborn struggle and wishing you victory over Russia’s brutal aggression. I also know that a Russian victory would be a great gift to Israel’s aggressive posture - a victory for its “Iron Wall” concept, which regulates its dealings with us until our complete defeat.
On the other hand, the struggle and victory of your people, even with the destruction of much of your country and the displacement of scores of Ukrainians, would give hope to other peoples struggling against oppression and erasure, rekindling our hopes for return and liberation. To this end, I urge you to stop supporting our oppressors.
https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/israel-palestine-war-ukraine-zelensky-denied-visit
The Ukrainian president has spoken strongly in favour of Israel after the surprise assault by Hamas on 7 October.
Israeli forces have since bombarded the Gaza Strip, killing at least 2,808 people, including 853 children and 936 women, as of 4pm GMT on Monday. At least 1,200, including 500 children, are missing and believed to be under rubble.
....
While Israel has repeatedly expressed support for Ukraine during the ongoing Russian invasion, it has been reluctant to provide Kyiv with military aid.
Following the assault, Zelensky said Hamas and Moscow were “the same evil, and the only difference is that there is a terrorist organisation that attacked Israel, and here is a terrorist state that attacked Ukraine”.
These statements have proved controversial because Israel is the occupying power in the Palestinian territories of the West Bank and Gaza, while Russia is occupying Ukraine.
I'll say most Ukrainians wish both sides "best of luck" (source: I'm Ukrainian) - to Israel because they supplied Lancet and Orlan technologies to Russia, to Iran because they supplied Shaheds and ballistic missiles to Russia, so these things are what directly impacted our lives and made them much worse.
As for why Zelensky sings praises for Taco Don from time to time - I don't believe that latter one can be swayed to help Ukraine (and Zelensky probably doesn't believe that too) but there's still Congress, that is somewhat cooperative from time to time, and we really need these sanctions that Taco Don now tries to delay and dilute.
Israel also supplied Drones to Russia after the Crimea invasion, didn't join sanctions and as reported by an Ukrainian official demanded Ukraine to surrender behind closed doors.
This is clear whataboutism. Iran and Israel can both be bad. Ukraine wants max pressure on the Russian war machine. So they cheer the weakening of a Russian military supplier. They also probably figure that if America is itching to fight again, it might as well help them out. They also probably sense the news cycle further shifting away from Ukraine and are trying to bring themselves into the conversation.
Israel started the attacks on Iran and the US joined in. The US diverted 20,000 anti drone missiles from Ukraine to the region instead. Zelensky already remarked that this will lead to more losses. Zelensky is playing in a game that is set to make Ukraine loose even more and it is crucial to understand that Israel is not a friend of Ukraine and will not leave any opportunity for its own benefit, no matter the cost for Ukraine.
“Without the help of the United States, we’ll have more losses,” Zelenskyy said in televised remarks.
More Ukraine-bound military aid may now be diverted to Israel, and the Kremlin “counts on this scenario”, analyst Smagin said.
This possible diversion already alarms Ukraine’s top brass.
Arms that were “made for Ukraine will go to the Middle East, so there are no illusions about it”, Lieutenant General Ihor Romanenko, former deputy head of Ukraine’s general staff of armed forces, told Al Jazeera.
If Tehran rejects Trump’s “ultimate ultimatum” to work out a peace deal, Washington’s attention to Iran and Israel may spell disaster for Kyiv.
“Undoubtedly, the US’s refocusing on the Middle East and Iran is a geopolitical catastrophe for us; there’s nothing to argue about,” Kyiv-based analyst Aleksey Kuschch told Al Jazeera.
That was 11 year ago... Things change, and will change again. When someone is at war you have to look for the help you can get now, not how things were or will be. Stalin was worse than Hitler, but the US supported Stalin in WWII because Hitler was attacking.
That's a really bad take.
Yes, people on previously Soviet-occupied territories that were occupied by Germans in WW2 often first met nazis with flowers as liberators, and even captured Soviet generals would at first slip some words that were quite critical of Soviet leadership.
But, as time passed on, the attitudes changed, so there was increase in guerilla activity and also some initial collaborators became rebels. That is simply because people started realizing how nazis were worse than anything.
it is possible for two opposing sides to be evil. If one evil is oppressing you that is the one you fight against but that doesn't mean you support the other. It is even possible for the worse evil to not oppress you as much.
This whole world war 3 bullshittery is hurting my brain
I keep wondering what our "Archduke Ferdinand" event will be, or if it has already happened.
preventive bombarding
Are you calling bombing and terrorizing of Ukrainian civilians for "preventive bombarding" ?
That is what Russia is calling its actions in Ukraine and your description of bombing and terrorizing Civilians both is true for Israel/US genocide in Gaza and the recent attacks on Iran, which have killed hundred of Civilians and hit hospitals, schools, journalists...
Ukraines government is either so backed against the wall or stupid to embrace these actions by Israel and the US, by which it legitimizes similar attacks on Ukrainian civilians.
But Ukraine is not "part of the club". Before the fullscale Russian invasion a lot of western sentiment was basically Ukraine being the same as Russia and part of "the other". And when the war eventually ends, the same will happen again quickly. The sad reality is that Ukraine has very little "friends" on the geopolitical stage.
That is what Russia is calling
Are you judging Russia based on their propaganda?
I don't condone the bombing of Iran, but the 2 situations are so far from similar your comparison is idiotic.
Ukraine is stupid to engage in the same propaganda rhetoric to please its "allies" that Russia uses to justify its attacks on Ukraine. It is bullshit in either cases and Ukraine weakens its position to call out bullshit legitimately by parroting the same talking points in a different constellation. This is especially true as Zelensky kept comparing Israel to Ukraine and with this comparison boosting Russias allegations of Ukrainian war crimes.
How is it similar if Ukraine see preventing Iran from having nukes as a legitimate target?
Ukraine gave up their nukes against guarantees that USA would help protect them.
Then Russia invades anyway in 2014, Because they want Crimea.
And Obama says to Ukraine they are on their own.
Then in 2022 Russia invade again, despite Ukraine is not in any way threatening Russia.
And Biden makes some half-assed support for Ukraine, giving them support, but only just enough to maintain a stalemate.
It is clearly no wonder why Ukraine want USA to make good on their promise, but USA is a shit country you can't rely on. It's n0ot just Trump, it's actually 3 presidents, and 2 of them were democratic.
But there is no way you can claim Ukraine is parroting Russia in this, the difference is that Iran is trying to get nukes, and Ukraine gave up theirs for protection.
But clearly the advice to Iran must be to get those nukes as fast as they freakingly can, because they can't trust Israel and USA to not attack unless they have them.
How is it similar if Ukraine see preventing Iran from having nukes as a legitimate target?
The IAEA said there was no evidence of that. The CIA said since their first assessment in 2007 Iran has not been seeking to develop nuclear weapons. An assessment that was reconfirmed in the 2025 intelligence report.
It was a lie and everyone knows it is a lie, except for the people gullible enough to follow the propaganda.
This was three days before the full scale invasion by Russia into Ukraine:
https://www.bbc.com/news/60711705
It is exactly the same play. "There is weapons of mass destructions. We need to prevent that!" Iran was neither threatening the US nor Israel with attacks and only responded to Israel attacks in 2024. Zelensky knows that. The knows that he is forsaking international law and truth in the hopes he would get some scraps.
So far I don't think the US strikes specifically on Iran are known to have killed or even wounded anyone, let alone civilians, nor hit hospitals or schools, right?
The US is providing weapons and intelligence for Israel to have targeted these places in Iran though. Furthermore the US is defending Israel against Iranian counterattacks so i would not distinguish the US from Israel in terms of responsibility.
Yeah but I don't think anyone was referring to Israel's actions as the US doing "preventative bombing"?
Even if they did kill someone it would be someone working in someway with nuclear materials. (including the person who cleans the bathroom there though)
Setting aside that they hit residential areas, what is that supposed to prove? Are scientists now valid military targets? Should Iran bomb Tel Aviv University? Are nuclear power plants now fair game in war?
I'm referring to the US, not Isreal. AFAIK the US only hit nuclear facilities, and anyone who would have died there was thus working in a nuclear facility.
Though Iran has been bombing Isreal residential areas for a long time - not directly, but they have been funding all the groups who have been sending bombs, morters, and everything else. Iran just deserves a share of the blame for Gaza genocide as if they were not enabling the attacks, Isreal would not be as interested in such attacks. (how much is not knowable, but there is a share for sure)
and anyone who would have died there was thus working in a nuclear facility.
Okay, and? To repeat myself, are scientists now valid military targets? Should Iran bomb Tel Aviv University? Are nuclear power plants fair game in war?
Iran just deserves a share of the blame for Gaza genocide as if they were not enabling the attacks, Isreal would not be as interested in such attacks.
That... is completely false. Like have you seen what they're doing to the pretty much completely submissive West Bank? All pretense of Israel acting in self-defense is pure fiction. Palestinians have the right to resist Israeli oppression by whatever means necessary.
Factories making military equipment have always been valid targets. Obviously I can't know for sure every site was working on nuclear weapons, but those that were are fair targets as far as I know.
Whether or not it was a good move is an entirely different thing though.
That is what Russia was calling it from the start.
I sure hope we prevent bomb some specific countries that also have current nuclear capabilities and play around in submarines and other shit.