this post was submitted on 18 Oct 2024
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Piracy: ꜱᴀɪʟ ᴛʜᴇ ʜɪɢʜ ꜱᴇᴀꜱ

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[–] deaf_fish@lemm.ee 11 points 1 hour ago

Generational wars doesn't do anyone any favors.

[–] Petter1@lemm.ee 7 points 2 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago) (2 children)
[–] Leate_Wonceslace@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 31 minutes ago

はい、そうです。

[–] Xatolos@reddthat.com 1 points 19 minutes ago

Present day. Present time.

[–] mizuki@lemmy.blahaj.zone 40 points 4 hours ago (4 children)

as a high schooler with a special interest in computers, it's genuinely surprising how poor most of my peers computers skills are. most of my peers don't even know the very basics of folder structures.

also unrelated, let's all love lain

[–] bane_killgrind@slrpnk.net 3 points 1 hour ago

Twenty years ago when I was 13, I started doing web stuff. This was back when everything was super simple, so everything to get a webserver up was super manual. I'll mention port forwarding at my current job and there's this slice of people that are 28-40 years old that know what I'm talking about.

[–] breakcore@discuss.tchncs.de 16 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago)

special interest

poor skill of peers

(I'm totally with you though)

[–] Petter1@lemm.ee 3 points 2 hours ago

I just watched lain some weeks ago without knowing what I have let me into 😂 got pretty confused, but I think in the end I got it. Probably..

[–] BallsandBayonets@lemmings.world 9 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

I blame google for the demise of well-organized folders. Their approach to email was "chuck it all in one big folder named Archive, and you can search for it using keywords that you will definitely remember when you need to find it again!"

It's a useful tool, but paved the way for the current state of affairs where people get overwhelmed by their email because they have 150,000 unread emails in their inbox and as a result, don't read an email until you tell them the entire contents of their email via the inferior messaging platform known as texting.

[–] averyminya@beehaw.org 10 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

Idk. I blame Apple, and Android hasn't done much to really bolster the need for file folders (not a bad thing, just lack of opportunity for learning).

But Apple actively prohibits its user base from engaging with folders, and has been for well over a decade - plenty long enough for my (millennial) generation to phase it out and for the generations after to never need them in the first place. Plus, emails aren't dependent on file paths, whereas systems file paths are completely necessary.

[–] tigeruppercut@lemmy.zip 2 points 2 hours ago (2 children)

Wait, with no folders how does apple deal with files these days? I'm a lifelong pc person so I have no idea

[–] averyminya@beehaw.org 4 points 38 minutes ago

You may as well have asked this question in 2012 because it's exactly the same as it was back then, except now there is iCloud. Which in some ways is impressive.

Folders are generic labels, Photos, Documents, Downloads, and within those there is folder structure, but I've never seen any Apple user actually utilize them beyond the most basic organizational functions (and even that is not common). Granted, my demographic for the past couple years has been the elderly, but before that I worked with kids and it was basically the same.

If you use Apple products, you don't need folder structures because you can't take files off your device easily, it basically has to go through some form of cloud upload, if not iCloud then Google Drive. And you don't need folder structures for the same reason, cause why are you adding files to your device from somewhere that isn't iCloud?

This is only like 95% facetious, it's actually ridiculous how closed off Apple makes their products. By default when you make a spreadsheet with Apple's software it exports as a .pages file, instead of the actually useful .xls. This is for every. Single. Program. Word files, PowerPoint files, I'm sure there's even a PDF specific Apple file format.

[–] Corr@lemm.ee 2 points 1 hour ago

As a user you can't access the filesystem. It's completely abstracted away. At least this was the case for the iPhone 6

[–] Auli@lemmy.ca 39 points 6 hours ago (2 children)

It’s like cars. Almost everyone has one and can drive it but don’t know how it works. Computers have become that. There are some who know or have an idea of how it works and others who can use it but have no idea.

[–] shirro@aussie.zone 3 points 1 hour ago* (last edited 53 minutes ago)

The expense of tools, equipment and supplies can be a huge barrier to car maintenance but there is so much legitimately free software for computers (even ignoring the pirated stuff) that people never had so much opportunity.

If is like learning another language or a musical instrument, people have to be committed and practice to get good and few people can make the effort. Businesses have trained people to seek instant gratification from fast food, social media, tik tok, gambling, loot boxes, and consumerism in general because short lived and unfulfilling experiences produce an endless monetization opportunity. The rare people with the discipline and support to focus their efforts have massive advantages with access to information and tools which were very difficult in the past. There are some prodigies out there in a sea of mediocrity.

[–] tetris11@lemmy.ml 8 points 5 hours ago (1 children)

Yeah but cars have become increasingly more complex over the last 20 years. You basically need an EEPROM arduino kit these days just to get the fucking diagnostics out of the car, because someone decided that analog circuits were just too much bulk

[–] SoleInvictus@lemmy.blahaj.zone 7 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago) (1 children)

I think their metaphor is referring to ease of use and the knowledge required for use. I have a few personal anecdotes as examples.

I'm an eighties kid. My first PC was a Commodore 64 and my first car was a 1966 VW Bug. Neither was reliable nor easy to use. I had to learn to utilize interfaces that were more finicky and complex than modern equivalents, and I spent a great deal of time learning how to make them work when they glitched out or were broken. The alternative was not having them at all. It was hard to get BBS advice when your PC took a dump and no one else you knew had one you could use, and then where would you get car advice? Certainly not from my dad!

A kid growing up with an Apple anything and driving a 20 year old car doesn't face the same kinds of difficulties. Many things just work more reliably and aren't as difficult to use. One can easily buy gaming systems now where we often had to build our own to get what we wanted. My buddy's 23 year old daughter had never even heard of CLI. That's all I had!

It doesn't make one generation better than the other - younger people today are skilled in ways I could have only dreamed of. We just have different opportunities for excellence.

[–] sqgl@beehaw.org 2 points 1 hour ago

younger people today are skilled in ways could have only dreamed of.

Any examples?

[–] incognito08@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

Without seeds, torrents become almost useless, and many pirate sites offer rare and hard-to-find movies/animes whose torrent versions never download because their seeds are practically extinct forever. So I don't think this is a weak complaint. If torrents didn't have this weakness I would always choose to use them but...

[–] Petter1@lemm.ee 6 points 2 hours ago

The usenet has many treasures

[–] potemkinhr@lemmy.ml 14 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

If you had real shitty internet back in the day (read 56k modem) and you liked to play russian roulette you would dump satellite traffic with a skystar2 DVB-S card. You never knew what you'd get realistically, found some true gems underneath mountains of coal in the day of (still) unfiltered internet.

[–] Enkers@sh.itjust.works 5 points 5 hours ago (1 children)

That's wild. Did you need a special program to parse stuff out of the data stream? I guess it would mostly come in as http reaponses, so it wouldn't be too hard, but still an interesting problem.

[–] potemkinhr@lemmy.ml 9 points 5 hours ago

Yep, used Skygrabber, you could filter out files depending on extensions, filenames etc and could narrow out what you wanted. Still had no real way of knowing what you'd end up with as you were effectively just passively listening on the satellite traffic. It was wild as you could fill out a 40 gig drive overnight without issues in the era where people were downloading a MP3 album for hours.

[–] collapse_already@lemmy.ml 35 points 7 hours ago (2 children)

I can't even tell you what us Gen Xers did because I am not sure if the statutes of limitations have run.

Vaguely, it involved ftp and file repositories hosted unwittingly by large companies plus restricted IRC channels to discuss the locations of such places.

[–] a1studmuffin@aussie.zone 7 points 5 hours ago

I remember installing a keylogger on the school library computers, then "accidentally" disconnecting the dialup internet and asking the teacher to type the login credentials again. I bet the ISP was confused when they saw so many concurrent logins after hours, all playing Quake and downloading huge files.

[–] BallsandBayonets@lemmings.world 3 points 4 hours ago

I miss my college days, Terabytes upon terabytes of "Linux ISOs" accessible via the blazing fast internal university network. And the IRC channel, where I learned what trolling was, but never learned to not feed the trolls.

[–] Pyflixia@kbin.melroy.org 49 points 8 hours ago (4 children)

No.

I've pointed this out on another account on this very community through KBin Social.

And I was talking about how lazy and entitled pirates across all ages have become overtime. That we were losing more and more sources that had withstood a long standing of time. And one moment everyone is going "RAH RAH! HYDRA! CUT ONE DOWN AND MORE COME UP!" but when we lose some of which that have yet to return or take it's place, the attitude grows weak. Almost desperate.

And it's due in part how most of the pirates just take and take, but never give back. On r/piracy and sometimes on here, people are making posts wondering where they can get free stuff and how they can get free stuff. They don't care about the technicalities, they don't care about the cause of piracy, they don't care at all. It's always "give me free shit, thanks, bye". There are few pirates out there doing the work and it's just so that these lazy and entitled pirates can just take and take.

But when we lose sources, they scatter away like cockroaches and all that they can think about is asking where it is that they can get free shit. It's almost like consumerism but for free shit, it's annoyingly disturbing. It's not about wanting the new product, it's about wanting the source to mooch off from.

I sadly predict in time that the whole hydra ideology will just simply become the way the Pirate Bay has become, just a symbol, but will it mean anything? It'll be so if this whole trend continues and all generations are just as guilty to doing it.

[–] tenchiken@lemmy.dbzer0.com 16 points 6 hours ago

The best pirates are librarians with legit ethics.

Preserve human knowledge and make it available to everyone.

I hate that you are right about mostly just greedy dipshits pissing in the high seas without contributing.

We should have taken up arms after Aaron Swartz...

[–] christian@lemmy.ml 15 points 7 hours ago

I agree with the sentiment that it's very easy to underestimate the harm done by the loss of a major site or scene group, but I'm not sure I really agree with much else you've written here. In particular:

And it’s due in part how most of the pirates just take and take, but never give back. On r/piracy and sometimes on here, people are making posts wondering where they can get free stuff and how they can get free stuff. They don’t care about the technicalities, they don’t care about the cause of piracy, they don’t care at all. It’s always “give me free shit, thanks, bye”.

The people making those posts have minimal exposure to piracy. This is getting your feet wet. For me, contributing my share is saying that I think these users deserve access. Yeah, they wouldn't have a place on a private tracker, that's not a problem because they're not on a private tracker, and if they join one they won't stay for long if they neglect seeding.

I'm sure a lot of these people will continue their lives without seeding or contributing. I won't say I endorse that, but I'm cool with it, and even if I wasn't I still don't think an argument can made that the harms of any hypothetical injustice here outweigh the benefits from a single dedicated pirate that began their journey this way.

I care about uploader counts, about seeder counts, about the wellbeing of the people who maintain the infrastructure. I'm invested. I don't care about download counts. Looking at an unseeded download as a loss in seeder count makes exactly the same amount of sense to me as looking at a download as a lost sale. I think it's morally right to support pirates who will not end up contributing, and beyond that I think treating them with kindness a net plus for the cause, because less than 100% of them will just say “give me free shit, thanks, bye”.

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[–] SplashJackson@lemmy.ca 3 points 4 hours ago

Yo Gundam Wing was sick, sweet music

[–] magic_smoke@links.hackliberty.org 31 points 9 hours ago* (last edited 9 hours ago) (5 children)

No most millennials are also too lazy because they stopped giving a shit about computers when it stopped being a requirement to use the internet like 10-15 years ago because smartphones.

Most who did haven't in at least a decade, and wouldn't unless you put a gun to their head.

For some reason the vast majority of people seem to just want to ignore the machines that literally run our society, and its fucking maddening.

FFS the amount of people who I work with in IT and even then don't really give a shit about they're daily computing is absolutely fucking baffling.

Its really just a smattering of people from all ages who actually know how to use a computer because they're actually interested in doing so.

[–] abbadon420@lemm.ee 3 points 6 hours ago

I like to think I know how to use a computer, but I mostly use my phone for private stuff. I have a few things running on my PC, but they're all online now in my local network and they have a mobile website through which I interact with them. Even my TV runs a frontend for things on my computer. Computer stuff has become an even broader spectrum of devices and skills than it used to be 20 years ago.

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[–] SexualPolytope@lemmy.sdf.org 63 points 10 hours ago* (last edited 10 hours ago) (1 children)

I think the gap stems from need. Most people only learn what they absolutely need to. My sister and I are just 3 years apart in age. Yet I am pretty familiar with tech, while she knows next to nothing. I was always there to fix whatever broke. Even now she knows that if she needs to watch something, she can just ask me to add it to my Jellyfin server. I often have to remote into her system to fix stuff.

The Gen Z we're talking about here mostly grew up using phones, and phone OSes do their best to hide any complexity away from the user. So they never learnt anything. I'm also technically Gen Z (very early), but growing up in rural India, I had to teach myself how to pirate since streaming wasn't a thing yet (our internet was too slow for that anyway), and the local theater didn't play anything except local mainstream cinema.

[–] __ghost__@lemmy.ml 12 points 8 hours ago (2 children)

Jellyseerr is your friend. She can request whatever and you can get alerts to add it. Even if your stuff isn't automated

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[–] ptz@dubvee.org 145 points 12 hours ago* (last edited 12 hours ago) (35 children)

I think it's more a generational gap in basic computer skills.

Millennials grew up alongside modern computing (meaning the two matured together). We dealt with everything from BASIC on a C64 to DOS and then through Windows 3 through current. We also grew up alongside Linux. We understand computers (mostly) and the (various) paradigms they use.

Gen Z is what I refer to as the iPad generation (give or take a few years). Everything's dumbed down and they never had to learn what a folder is or why you should organize documents into them instead of throwing them all in "Documents" library and just using search. (i.e. throw everything in a junk drawer and rummage through it as needed).

As with millennials who can't balance a checkbook or do basic household tasks, I don't blame Gen Z for not learning; I blame those who didn't teach them. In this case, tech companies who keep dumbing everything down.

Edit: "Balance a checkbook" doesn't have to mean a physical transaction log for old school checks. It just means keeping track of expenditures and deposits so that you know the money in your account is sufficient to cover your purchases. You'd be surprised how many people my age can't manage that.

[–] jabathekek@sopuli.xyz 55 points 11 hours ago (6 children)

you should organize documents into them instead of throwing them all in “Documents” library and just using search.

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[–] Irelephant@lemm.ee 3 points 5 hours ago

Not exactly, first of all, this is pretty divisive which I dislike, a lot of late Gen z can and has torrented and used ddl sites. It's early Gen z and Gen alpha that is hopeless.

[–] JoMiran@lemmy.ml 53 points 11 hours ago (3 children)
[–] christian@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 hours ago

Older millennials absolutely terrified of the dianogas in Anoat City.

[–] vulgarcynic@sh.itjust.works 4 points 5 hours ago

I'm in this picture and I appreciate it.

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[–] odium@programming.dev 17 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

I'm gen z born in the early 200xs and I torrent (legal Linux ISOs ofc)

[–] funkajunk@lemm.ee 13 points 8 hours ago

How else are you going to get your hands on the latest build of Hannah Montana Linux?

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