this post was submitted on 06 Nov 2023
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[–] DrugsMcChrist@lemmy.ml 97 points 1 year ago (2 children)

The problem is that this is a strategy, and it might work. The judge is showing signs of exasperation. The defense is laying the grounds for an appeal based on judicial bias. Viewed in that light, each time the judge interjects out of annoyance or exasperation is citable evidence. It's funny, but it is also rather dangerous.

[–] grue@lemmy.world 103 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

The judge needs to calmly and patiently explain to Trump that he will be jailed for contempt if he doesn't follow the rules and act in good faith, and then dispassionately follow through with that consequence.

Don't threaten him, don't cajole his lawyers to constrain him, don't complain about his behavior. Just give him a time-out, like the petulant toddler he is, until he gets it through his skull that his bullshit won't be tolerated.

Once he comes back, if he won't agree to behave or if he does promise to behave and then breaks that promise, simply immediately put him back in the cell for another round.

Trump needs to see the inside of a holding cell for a while in order to act right.

[–] Wrench@lemmy.world 32 points 1 year ago (8 children)

As much as I'd love to see it, jailing him for contempt would play right into their plan. He wouldn't see 24hr of cell time before his fanatic base would be whipped into violence, painted as political persecution of the GOP (defacto) nominee

It's all paper thin excuses to anyone with critical thinking, but we know it'd be a successful ploy.

[–] TwoGems@lemmy.world 27 points 1 year ago

They already do violence who cares. Every mass shooting is almost always a Trump supporter.

[–] iforgotmyinstance@lemmy.world 26 points 1 year ago

What the fuck is the national guard for then? It's the correct and legal punishment, and it's a matter of national security. These concepts are not conflicting.

[–] shalafi@lemmy.world 22 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I'm prepared to defend myself, my family and my home. Ever fought a bully? They fucking cave with the quickness.

One silly bitch got shot through the neck and they scrambled out of that part of the Capitol.

I'm not brave, but if they think I'm harmless, they are free to test that assumption.

[–] Fades@lemmy.world 14 points 1 year ago

Get fucked Babbitt

[–] AngryCommieKender@lemmy.world 17 points 1 year ago

Fuck em. They already sent their best on Jan 6. I'm not impressed. The National Guard can steamroll them and the cops if the cops turn traitor.

[–] grue@lemmy.world 15 points 1 year ago (1 children)
  1. It doesn't even need to be 24 hours. I suspect giving him even a 1-hour time-out would be plenty.

  2. I couldn't care less what The Base thinks of it.

[–] badbytes@lemmy.world 13 points 1 year ago

It's not terrible for the crazies to show us where they be.

[–] ghostdoggtv@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago

Let them do their violence, it'll end like Ft. Sumpter the first time around.

[–] PeleSpirit@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago

The thing is, no one is showing up for his side to protest. They didn't in Miami either.

[–] DogMuffins@discuss.tchncs.de 27 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

I don't think it's a strategy, it's just a happy potential by-product, albeit an unlikely one.

Sure it's possible that a judge might make mistakes that may form the basis for a successful appeal. Is Engoron more likely to make mistakes because of Trump's antics? Not necessarily. Most people do their best work under pressure.

Trump's behavior is focused as always on his supporters. The more he appears to be persecuted the more his supporters will throw money at him - it's that simple. He's intentionally pushing the judge as far as he can without crossing the line into actual consequences.

Edit: as an aside the photos of these idiots always makes me think about how much time they've spent practicing their facial expressions in a mirror.

[–] Telorand@reddthat.com 17 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I'll add to that that wasting a judge's time through non-compliance is a fast track to default judgment. Just ask Alex Jones how that goes.

The right to a speedy trial is a right for the prosecutors, too.

[–] TechyDad@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago

Not just wasting the judge's time, but yelling at and insulting the judge on the stand. I'm no lawyer, but I doubt this is a legal strategy that any reputable legal professional would recommend.

[–] perviouslyiner@lemm.ee 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Already got the equivalent of a default judgement - he's already ruled on the law.

[–] Telorand@reddthat.com 1 points 1 year ago

Right, but not for the punitive damages part.

[–] WhatAmLemmy@lemmy.world 79 points 1 year ago (2 children)

"You are the most guilty, uncooperative, unapologetic criminal I've ever dealt with" — Judge

Slap on wrist — also, Judge

I'll believe otherwise when I see it.

[–] RojoSanIchiban@lemmy.world 51 points 1 year ago

This judge already ruled that the Trump enterprise in NY is dead and for all business licenses to be pulled. That has been stayed pending appeal. They will not win the appeal.

This trial is purely for damages to see just how much of Trump's assets will have to be liquidated once Judge Engoron determines an amount based on this ridiculous "testimony."

Hint: it's going to be a metric fuckload

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 51 points 1 year ago (1 children)

At one point he indicated that he had sometimes felt the values assigned to his properties were off, but stated that the discrepancies were both “high and low.”

"Your honor, I'd like to take this opportunity to defend myself by confirming the facts of the case and also that I didn't listen when you told me what I'm accused of!" - The former POTUS

[–] meco03211@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Sure I've punched people, but sometimes I hurt myself so that means I'm innocent of the times I hurt others.

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago

It's even worse than that: apart from the overvaluing for insurance and other purposes that everyone's focusing on, he's also been undervaluing the very same properties to evade taxes, further undercutting both the "honest mistake " and "had no idea" defenses.

[–] theostermanweekend@lemmy.ml 32 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Fucking astounds me how this grifter is pulling numbers....everyone for him is just doing it for spite now...

[–] PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee 29 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

You underestimate the electoral power of making rural white folks feel like they can say the N-word without being looked down on as racist trash

These are the rat fuckers who think the president will make their families come back for thanksgiving again even though they have done no work to address that they all left because they tried to force some poor young girl onto cousin Maury with his husband right fucking there.

[–] MonkRome@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Tell me you've never lived in a rural area without telling me you never lived in a rural area. Don't get me wrong, I'm incredibly confused and usually revolted by trump supporters, but the rampant intolerance of rural people is also revolting.

[–] PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee -3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

If Trump's rural supporters want to be tolerated they're the ones that gotta put the effort in to be tolerable.

You don't see the rest of us dragging the entire country down to cling to child beauty pageants child marriage and child massacres.

[–] MonkRome@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

You're tying a group that's not a monolith with another group that's not a monolith and making a number of assumptions in both cases. Not only are a lot of rural people left wing and not at all racist. But I've yet to meet a single rural person that married their cousin, but I have met a city person that has.

Alternatively, the other week I was riding a taxi with this black guy who was as left wing as they come, had very progressive ideas, and was Trump's biggest fan, he was absolutely obsessed with Trump. He thinks there is some big conspiracy that makes all other politicians evil and Trump is going to save us.

When you make basic generalizations about groups of people you increase divisiveness and make the problem worse. Rural people know city liberals look down on them, and that pushes the divide further and further. I grew up in a heavily liberal rural area that is becoming more and more right wing, and people exactly like you are responsible. People like you made that happen. Be better.

[–] PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Nah brah, it's on ACAB mode at this point, either you are a bastard, or you've been successfully intimidated into not openly being anything but a bastard. It's not the fault of the disgusted that rural communities are behaving disgustingly.

Liberals and leftists don't owe rural right wingers anything but contempt for literally being 99% of why we are stuck where we are as a country via the Senate and EC, and the escape hatch is always open for any self proclaimed liberals and leftists stuck in rural right wing communities to flee to where they'll be safe, that is, if they actually care about being a liberal or a leftist more than they care about "I can't stand the cities!" their entire personality. Because seriously, it's always "but muh fresh air" to explain why they don't leave after the third swastika was found on a local Jewish grave stone.

These communities literally rob cities of their autonomy out of nothing but spite and weird suburbanite colonization making cities unsafe for city residents in the name of being able to force them to accomodate their "not compensating for anything" loser trucks, but heaven forbid the cities gasp be less than gracious to the fuckers about it.

And BTW, this is all from a man who's lived in cow country since he was six. The call is coming from inside the house, but apparently everyone who's disgusted with rural backwardness must just be some city slicker liberal looking down on perfectly normal acceptable behavior and culture!

[–] psivchaz@reddthat.com 10 points 1 year ago

I've definitely seen a lot of backfire effect going on. If you voted for Trump because, for example, you thought that a political outsider would fix everything and you ignored all the bad shit in hopes that it would work out, then it's hard now to admit that you were wrong. Admitting that Trump sucks is also, for those people, admitting that they were foolish to ever believe in him, which is a difficult and intolerable admission. Better to just ignore evidence and move forward blindly in support.

At least, I've seen a lot of that in my mostly purple area where the divide is only getting worse and stronger.

[–] gatelike@feddit.de 7 points 1 year ago

This free book from 1951 about mass movements explains what is going on. They feel their lives are spoiled and maga gives them hope. Logic doesn't matter.

The True Believer - Eric Hoffer https://www.academia.edu/21464682/The_True_Believer_Eric_Hoffer

[–] NocturnalMorning@lemmy.world 14 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I'm sure that will go over great.

[–] heeplr@feddit.de 10 points 1 year ago (1 children)
[–] NocturnalMorning@lemmy.world 16 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Us mere mortals would already be in the slammer for half the stuff he's done.

[–] CADmonkey@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

We'd have been tackled by the bailiff at least once.

[–] zcd@lemmy.ca 2 points 1 year ago
[–] autotldr@lemmings.world 10 points 1 year ago

This is the best summary I could come up with:


Donald Trump was rebuked by Judge Arthur Engoron for giving “speeches” during his testimony on Monday before New York court in a civil fraud trial that will determine the future of his business empire.

“Some of your answers have not been in response to the question,” Engoron told Trump earlier in his testimony, adding that prosecuting attorney Kevin Wallace had been “very patient.”

“Getting ready to head to the Downtown Lower Manhattan Courthouse to testify in one of the many cases that were instigated and brought by my POLITICAL OPPONENT, Crooked Joe Biden, through agencies and surrogates, for purposes of ELECTION INTERFERENCE,” Trump wrote.

“Got a really Biased, Nasty, Club controlled, but often overturned, Judge, a Racist, Evil, and Corrupt Attorney General,” he added.” A dark day for our Country.

The former president has already been fined twice, and threatened with jail time, for violating a gag order put in place by Engoron after he attacked one of the judge’s clerks on social media.

On Friday, Engoron expanded the order, which barred the former president from publicly commenting on members of the court’s staff, to include similar restrictions on the statements of Trump’s attorneys.


The original article contains 858 words, the summary contains 194 words. Saved 77%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!

[–] KpntAutismus@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

the american justice system right now: i can't wait for the final sentence

[–] killeronthecorner@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago

It'll be the first time he's ever finished a full sentence without rambling about fly paper or injecting disinfectant.

[–] YoBuckStopsHere@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

Good luck with that.