this post was submitted on 27 Mar 2025
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[–] cupcakezealot@lemmy.blahaj.zone 14 points 2 days ago (1 children)

good to see teller talked some sense into him

[–] Tiger666@lemmy.ca 4 points 2 days ago

I see what you did there.

[–] FreakinSteve@lemmy.world 28 points 2 days ago (1 children)

I am a PJ fan and follower, but I am well aware that he has long been a naive idiot operating from a place of priviledge. He is well insulated from the pitfalls of the ideas he espouses, and it took an UNDENIABLE COLLAPSE into straight up Nazism for him to finally grasp it.

Luv ya Penn, but I ain't giving you any fucking medals

[–] prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Yeah, but the bar is through the floor at this point. I'll take anything I can get.

[–] nomy@lemmy.zip 13 points 2 days ago

And the more people come out and say "oh shit I was wrong" the easier it becomes for others to do the same.

[–] kiwii4k@lemmy.zip 39 points 2 days ago (20 children)

anyone who claims to be "a libertarian" should be forced to watch the libertarian convention which YOU KNOW none of them have ever seen in their lives.

check out the ideas your "party" pushes. real big brain stuff.

there's nothing wrong with freedom, but regulation is necessary. to say otherwise is either ignorance, stupidity, or malice.

[–] Pirata@lemm.ee 11 points 2 days ago (1 children)

to say otherwise is either ignorance, stupidity, or malice

Why not all three?

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[–] maporita@lemmy.ca 112 points 3 days ago (12 children)

"A lot of the illusions that I held dear, rugged individualism, individual freedoms, are coming back to bite us in the ass. It seems like getting rid of the gatekeepers gave us Trump as president, and in the same breath, in the same wind, gave us not wearing masks, and maybe gave us a huge unpleasant amount of overt racism."

Hats off to a man willing to admit he made a mistake.

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[–] madcaesar@lemmy.world 43 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Being wrong admitting it and changing your mind with new information is absolutely amazing and a great character trait. Props to him.

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[–] prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 points 2 days ago (1 children)

I haven't always agreed with him politically, but Penn Jillette seems like a good dude.

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[–] demizerone@lemmy.world 26 points 3 days ago (3 children)

Penn Jilletet pulled me 100 % onto the vaccine train with his ball and shield demonstration with teller on their bull shit show. Until this day, I still haven't seen any demonstration that was more convincing than that on any subject in the amount of time that they used.

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[–] SidTheShuckle@lemmy.blahaj.zone 25 points 3 days ago (3 children)

There used to be a time back when libertarianism was anti-capitalist. Then right wingers stole it and turned it into a circus.

[–] Maggoty@lemmy.world 9 points 2 days ago

Long before most of us were alive yes.

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[–] blackbelt352@lemmy.world 301 points 4 days ago (32 children)

Penn Gilette has always seemed to be driven by a level of honesty and compassion and valued the freedom to choose where to direct that compassion. I think earlier on he viewed other libertarians as having the same level of honest compassion as he does but over time it's become more and more clear that libertarians are overwhelmingly selfish rich white guys who don't want to be called Repuiblicans.

I mean in the early 2000s he was calling bullshit on the hysteria over the vaccine autism link saying the alternative of kids dying to preventable diseases is so much worse. He even gave the tenuous link a benefit of the doubt and accepted that even if they did cause autism,t he alternative is so much worse.

[–] CosmicTurtle0@lemmy.dbzer0.com 102 points 4 days ago (5 children)

There aren't many people who are willing to evaluate their entire political decisions and come to the conclusion that they were wrong. Even fewer who will admit it publicly. Even fewer still who will accept responsibility and then do something about it.

Of the people I have respectfully disagreed with, the fact that he's come around is a huge testament to his willingness to be humbled and corrected.

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[–] puppinstuff@lemmy.ca 40 points 3 days ago (3 children)

I got to meet him in Vegas. He was really nice to a nervous nerd. Now I’m even more impressed he has the courage to change his beliefs in public.

[–] MJKee9@lemmy.world 22 points 3 days ago

A sign of true intelligence is the ability to change your opinions after consideration and evidence. Penn always struck me as a very intelligent man.

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[–] hanrahan@slrpnk.net 75 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

"I did not mean that Conservatives are generally stupid; I meant, that stupid persons are generally Conservative" - John Stuart Mill

[–] Walican132@lemmy.today 142 points 4 days ago (7 children)

The smartest people in the room are those who are willing to admit a mistake, or that their opinions have changed.

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[–] BilboBargains@lemmy.world 26 points 3 days ago

Self awareness is such a precious thing in people but it is a prerequisite for this type of personal growth. It can be difficult but ultimately it is rewarding and fulfilling to realise there are things that you don't like about yourself and set about correcting them.

[–] moakley@lemmy.world 16 points 3 days ago (9 children)

I've always considered myself a libertarian, but I'm coming to realize I need to find another word. I used to be able to explain that assholes were ruining the name, but now the assholes outnumber people like me by too much.

I think the real turning point was when Jo Jorgensen said, "It is not enough to be passively not racist, we must be actively anti-racist," and then she had to walk it back because the libertarian party was so fucking racist. Like, that's not even a political statement. It's a moral one, and it's one I agree with.

Then when the Libertarian Party changed their stance on abortion, I was done with them. I clung to the lowercase L label, but at this point it doesn't seem worth it anymore.

I just think the government should be limited to things that only the government can handle. Policing? Roads? Business regulations? Those are all things that can only be handled by the government. Restrictions on what kind of stove I can buy? Restrictions on what I can put in my body or how I dress or what my kids can read at school? Those are all bullshit.

I guess it helps that I align with Democrats on most of the major issues now, but I still won't consider myself a Democrat.

[–] Maggoty@lemmy.world 20 points 2 days ago (7 children)

Stoves are a great example of why the richest among us want to push libertarianism. You see the freedom to buy a gas stove. They see the freedom to make products that are one penny cheaper but kill their users.

Libertarianism and anarchism in general fail to account for sociopaths who are willing to make others suffer for their own gain.

[–] prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (1 children)

Libertarianism and anarchism in general fail to account for sociopaths who are willing to make others suffer for their own gain.

Yeah this is the main thing keeping me from adopting anarchism in any meaningful way... I like the concept of mutual aid, but I think anarchism itself relies too heavily on the idea that all people are inherently good. I think that the events of the past decade or so have eliminated all doubt for me that this isn't the case.

[–] Maggoty@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Don't get me wrong, I think there's useful lessons in anarchism and leftist libertarianism. They aren't bad philosophies, just not workable in a pure state

[–] prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 1 day ago
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[–] Fredthefishlord@lemmy.blahaj.zone 16 points 2 days ago (6 children)

Conservatives didn't ruin libertarianism. Libertarianism has always been bad.

Restrictions on what kind of stove I can buy?

Stuff like this is a perfect example of the issues with libertarian ideology. They want freedom to continue to destroy the environment.

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[–] klu9@lemmy.ca 104 points 4 days ago (3 children)

Cool to see the meme applied to someone who genuinely went to clown college!

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[–] lobut@lemmy.ca 58 points 3 days ago

The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.

John Kenneth Galbraith


I think Penn went there with a different mindset than those occupying the space now.

[–] technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 110 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago) (14 children)

As a big fan of P&T, this is a major win.

Not to mention the veganism which is also closely related to rejecting fascism.

https://vegnews.com/magician-penn-jillette-goes-vegan-for-the-animals

(Full disclosure: I saw an interview where Penn says he went vegan for health and weight loss. But maybe he's evolved to animal liberation as well.)

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