cross-posted from: https://lemmy.world/post/24764351
Systemd-boot and the service files and timers are pretty neat. Works fine as an init too I guess
this post was submitted on 26 Jan 2025
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Anything that lets me avoid the aberration that is Grub is great.
Those are the features Iβm most interested in. Do you have a tutorial / resource you can recommend?
The man pages are, as with most Linux, technically sufficient. Just very hard to digest if I donβt have four hours of interrupted time.
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My thoughts on systemd:
It's one of the init systems of all time.
it makes my computer start. thatβs pretty neat I think
I like the way I can make the timeout 0 so I don't even need to think about it doing its job :)
SystemD works great, but the corporations and politics behind it will ruin Linux if they fully take over. They are already optimizing heavily for IoT just because IBM is heavily focused on IoT
I'm pretty sure IBM hasn't focussed on IoT in a long time
(In the sense that I used to work there and know they've both reduced investment in, and fully removed, some parts of their portfolio regarding IoT)
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IBM is heavily focused on IoT
Oh no, IBM wants to put a System/390 in every lightbulb!
So, back to incandescent bulbs? Because the overheated processor will generate more light than the LED.
IBM's revolutionary lighting and home heating device.
I learned systemd first so its comfy π€·ββοΈ
I feel that. I've used Linux before systemd but when I went into the "nitty gritty" by using arch systemd had just been implemented and everything I learned about startup services init etc. was systemd based. When I started my career working in servers they were redhat/CentOS so still systemd and when I switched jobs Debian already had made the switch so (most of) the systems at my new job were also systemd based. Of course I learned the basics of init files and even some rc.d but systemd still makes the most sense to me and like you say it's "comfy".
You had me at "declarative".
Would you elaborate? Is systemd config not declarative?
It is. The cracker in the second panel lists several benefits of systemd, including declarative config.
They're saying it is, and they like it because it is.
Its a meme phrase.
Ahh thanks, my English is not so sharp.
Anyone got a good tutorial/guide fir SystemD?
Figure I may as well try to wrap my head around it if it's supposedly going to murder me in my sleep or whatever.
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I dislike journalctl more than systemd. And I don't get what's the advantage of systemctl vs previous solutions, why would that of all things make one reconsider.
I miss rc.local and crontabs. Now if you excuse me I have a cloud to yell at.
The only advantage I see is that it actually seems to keep a better handle on the status of the process/service. The old-style unit scripts would often get out of sync and not realize that a process had died, or if they did they would repeatedly respawn a service that would just die again. Maybe that was less of a problem in later years than I experienced earlier, but it was there.
The whole init.d system felt very ad-hoc with every script working a little bit differently, giving different output styles, etc.
Fair enough.
@pewgar_seemsimandroid systemd has a lot of really good things...
But it's too complex for init process and even too complex for service manager. Many solib dependencies causes long start, big memory footprint and possibe security issues. Many things might be implemented in some separate services, running with restricted permissions and optionally disabled.
initng was very similar to systemd, but was very simple and very much faster
{insert IBM conspiracy here}
The Nazis will overtake us, one red hat at a time
Try to pass init= and you'll see reduced RAM usage. Systemd is bloated.
Hell, pass init=/bin/yes and you'll see even more greatly reduced RAM usage!
β― ps aux | grep /usr/lib/sys | awk '{print $6}' | sed 's/$/+/' | tr -d '\n' | sed 's/+$/\n/' | bc
266516
So that's 260 MiB of RSS (assuming no shared libs which is certainly false) for:
- Daemon manager
- Syslog daemon
- DNS daemon (which I need and would have to replace with dnsmasq if it did not exist)
- udev daemon
- network daemon
- login daemon
- VM daemon (ever hear of the principle of least privilege?)
- user daemon manager (I STG anyone who writes a user daemon by doing
nohup &needs to be fired into the sun.pkillis not the tool I should have to use to manage my user's daemons)
For comparison the web page I'm writing this on uses 117 MiB, about half. I'll very gladly make the tradeoff of two sh.itjust.works tabs for one systemd suite. Or did you send that comment using curl because web browsers are bloated?
For another comparison 200 MiB of RAM is less than two dollars at current prices. I don't value my time so low that I'll avoid spending two bucks by spend hours debugging whatever bash scripting spaghetti hell other init systems cling onto to avoid "bloat". I've done it, don't miss it.
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journalctl and binary logging are annoying bullshit.
Amen.
I've used both runnit and systemD and I prefer systemD. Nothing against runnit and I love Void Linux.
runit entering the chat
Well, I think that if declarative configuration is what you're looking for, the GNU Guix distro with its GNU Shepherd init system might be a more pertinent solution than SystemD
Hell yea +1 for shepherd.
Declarativity on steroids.
Aren't all configs declarative?
some other init systems just use scripts for config, meaning you can just do whatever
Configs can do whatever too.
a config file can do only what the program that reads it allows. if the program that reads the file is just bash...
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