this post was submitted on 07 Sep 2024
226 points (89.2% liked)

Lemmy Shitpost

26821 readers
3536 users here now

Welcome to Lemmy Shitpost. Here you can shitpost to your hearts content.

Anything and everything goes. Memes, Jokes, Vents and Banter. Though we still have to comply with lemmy.world instance rules. So behave!


Rules:

1. Be Respectful


Refrain from using harmful language pertaining to a protected characteristic: e.g. race, gender, sexuality, disability or religion.

Refrain from being argumentative when responding or commenting to posts/replies. Personal attacks are not welcome here.

...


2. No Illegal Content


Content that violates the law. Any post/comment found to be in breach of common law will be removed and given to the authorities if required.

That means:

-No promoting violence/threats against any individuals

-No CSA content or Revenge Porn

-No sharing private/personal information (Doxxing)

...


3. No Spam


Posting the same post, no matter the intent is against the rules.

-If you have posted content, please refrain from re-posting said content within this community.

-Do not spam posts with intent to harass, annoy, bully, advertise, scam or harm this community.

-No posting Scams/Advertisements/Phishing Links/IP Grabbers

-No Bots, Bots will be banned from the community.

...


4. No Porn/ExplicitContent


-Do not post explicit content. Lemmy.World is not the instance for NSFW content.

-Do not post Gore or Shock Content.

...


5. No Enciting Harassment,Brigading, Doxxing or Witch Hunts


-Do not Brigade other Communities

-No calls to action against other communities/users within Lemmy or outside of Lemmy.

-No Witch Hunts against users/communities.

-No content that harasses members within or outside of the community.

...


6. NSFW should be behind NSFW tags.


-Content that is NSFW should be behind NSFW tags.

-Content that might be distressing should be kept behind NSFW tags.

...

If you see content that is a breach of the rules, please flag and report the comment and a moderator will take action where they can.


Also check out:

Partnered Communities:

1.Memes

2.Lemmy Review

3.Mildly Infuriating

4.Lemmy Be Wholesome

5.No Stupid Questions

6.You Should Know

7.Comedy Heaven

8.Credible Defense

9.Ten Forward

10.LinuxMemes (Linux themed memes)


Reach out to

All communities included on the sidebar are to be made in compliance with the instance rules. Striker

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
 
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

encyclopedias are not dictionaries

[–] Enkers@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

An astute observation. Good thing I get all my knowledge from dictionaries so I can have a paper thin understanding of everything.

[–] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

to be clear, dictionaries record the most common uses of terms. consulting a philosophy encyclopedia is not a good way to understand a term as it is used in vulgar vernacular.

[–] Enkers@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

If we we're having a discussion about physics, presumably we would use the terminology of physics. If we are having a discussion about morality and ethics (fields of philosophy, that is) we should probably use the terminology of philosophy. If you want to play semantic games, play them by yourself.

Veganism is an ethical position and as such can only be properly understood in the context of ethics.

[–] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

if the vegan society wants to create an additional carve-out for consensual exploitation in addition to its exceptions for practicability and possibility, it's not as though they are unaware of these concepts. they have not done so, and there is no reason to believe they mean to do so.

[–] Enkers@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

We're not talking about consensual exploitation. Were talking about behaviors that aren't exploitation due to, or perhaps shown not to be so by consent. There's no need to explicitly mention consent because a) it would needlessly complicate the definition, b) as a practical matter, it almost never actually arises except in these sorts of thought experiments, and c) it's already included implicitly in the concept of exploitation.

Let's look at our original thought experiment: "It's vegan to eat someone who has consented to being eaten."

Usually we don't put too much thought into this sort of stuff because it doesn't really come up much outside of tongue in cheek mention, but I digress.

OK, so off the bat, if you think about it, there are indeed some problems with this statement. There could be systemic issues that made them consent to something harmful because the transactional benefit outweighs the harm to them. So in that sense, you're right, looking directly for exploitation is the more objectively vegan thing to do.

However what if they have a genuine desire to be eaten (non-injuriously or posthumously, hopefully) where there are no confounding influences like above? The absence of exploitation is indicated through consent, in this case, and indeed, without any form of consent the other party would have no way to know of their desire to be eaten.

I think maybe a more realistic example than eating someone would be "Is it vegan to honour someone's organ-donor card?" That seems to me to be a fairly clearcut case of accepting consent as implying non-exploitation.

[–] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

The absence of exploitation is indicated through consent,

no, it's not. it's exploitation by the barest definition, like exploiting a fallow field or a forest. the definition of exploitation can by synonymously defined as "use". using a corpse is exploiting it. using a corpse which has, with informed consent, been consigned for use is still exploitation.

[–] Enkers@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

That would imply that vegans could not have sex with each other because it "uses" the body of an animal.

Exploitation involves one using the vulnerability of another in order to gain something in an unfair manner. It's not simply "use".

[–] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

the barest definition is a synonym of "use". the vegan society could clear up this ambiguity but they have chosen not to do so, and there is no reason to assume they prefer a special definition of exploitation.

[–] Enkers@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

If you want the barest understanding, I guess the barest definitions are "good enough". If you want a more sophisticated understanding then you have to take the time to understand the actual philosophical lexicon that the definition relies upon, since, as it points out itself, "Veganism is a philosophy".

Y'know, considering your username is commie, I'm surprised you don't have a better understanding of exploitation, as Marx was really pivotal in developing that philosophical concept.

[–] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

I'm surprised you don't have a better understanding of exploitation

you have no idea what my understanding is. that's not the subject of our discussion. don't make this personal.

we are discussing the vegan society's understanding.

[–] Enkers@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (2 children)

Approximately 0.01% of lemmy's user base would conflate simple "use" with exploitation. I warned you about sophistry before. If you have knowledge relevant to the domain at hand, put it to use, or stop wasting both of our time.

[–] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 months ago

Approximately 0.01% of lemmy’s user base would conflate simple “use” with exploitation.

can you substantiate this?

[–] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 months ago

stop wasting both of our time.

you’re free to not respond at any time.