this post was submitted on 03 Aug 2023
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Apple
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Apple needs to have a look at the new Surface devices: https://www.theverge.com/2023/6/14/23761037/microsoft-surface-spare-replacement-parts-microsoft-store and https://www.theverge.com/2022/11/11/23453263/microsoft-surface-pro-9-repairability-improved-ifixit-teardown
But instead they're already bitching to the press about this new regulations. This is the same crap they pulled with USB-C, still no USB-C iPhones whatsoever and unlike everyone else I'm not confident it will happen this year. To be frank Apple even decided to srew the customer even more by having newer iPhones come with USB-C to lightening cables and without a charger instead of plain USB-A.
230$ for a battery!! They have lost their minds lol.
Well, still better than 1000$ for a new iPhone because you can't replace it yourself, Apple won't do it for almost the price of a new phone and they lock 3rd party batteries with serialization :) and you can buy 3rd party batteries for a fraction of the cost. What matters is that 1) you can replace the battery - no glued, soldered bs and 2) they actually sell them.
Apple charges $99 for a battery replacement.
It’s not cemented into the chassis lol, Apple replaces it for $99 or you can just buy the part from ‘em and replace it yourself.
Yes the batteries are cemented into the chassis :D The last 3 times I tried to use the pull tabs they added they simply broke before the battery was out.
I mean, that sucks for you but pull-tabs are considered ‘repair-friendly’ by pretty much everyone in the Right to Repair movement.
I believe they might work for a bit of time, but with usage and eat they probably go bad and end up breaking. If you see on YouTube Rossman and others they've similar experiences.
Rossman is a device repairman tbf, he sees the worst of the worst phones out there.
He seems mostly iPhones, and his experiences with pull tabs are similar to mine.
Well, it is what it is. Maybe they could use better glue, idk.
Or simply avid that BS all together and hold batteries in place with screws and/or a simple metal slab holding it in place.
If they can do that without increasing the phone’s size/thickness or compromising its performance and/or battery life, I’d be all for it.
Yeah I agree, it's better to be able to change them than not.
Either way that price point still hurts for a battery (when an original standard enterprise laptop battery is usually less than half the price)
Yes, it's very overpriced.
Surface is literally twice the thickness of the iPhone (14 vs 7mm). That makes a waterproof iPhone with user-replaceable battery very very difficult, especially since users complained that iphones are heavier than previous models.
Isn't Apple allegedly good at engineering? I'm sure they could find a way. There are old Nokia phones that are as thick as current iPhones (or less) and have use-replaceable batteries. This has nothing to do with waterproof, its all about their continued interest in using planned obsolesce and other means to sell new devices.
Being "good at engineering" doesn't change the laws of physics.
Those Nokia phones were not waterproof. Also, I'm pretty sure they were thicker.
An o-ring only works if the battery cover is rigid enough that it will not flex at all even if, for example, you drop the phone in cold water rapidly cooling the battery cover while the internals stay warm for a minute or two.
The battery cover will change size slightly with the temperature change and no screw can be strong enough to stop that. Covering the entire battery cover in glue and attaching it to the battery though.. that will eliminate the movement.
Perhaps Apple can find a water proof battery. But there's no way they can keep water out of the battery compartment while being user serviceable.
It’s always amusing when people who aren’t engineers assume something must be simple to make. Please show me a Nokia phone that was as thin as a current iPhone, with auto focusing video cameras (aka moving parts), and had a user-replaceable battery. I’ll wait. Samsung’s galaxy phones caught fire because they tried to make it just as thin ~~with a user-replaceable battery~~ (leading to short circuits), so that’s yet another thing you have to prevent in your hypothetical “it’s easy!” phone. Oh and it has to be rugged enough to withstand multiple drops like current phones AND not lose any of that thinness.
Edit: okay the galaxy battery wasn’t replaceable but you still need to make higher tolerances in a user-replaceable item to prevent that, meaning it cannot be too thin for safety reasons.
The Samsung note 7 that had the exploding battery issues wasn't a removable /swappable battery, so you're wrong. That whole phone was as glued together as iPhones of the time.
Such a weird take.
Good point, but that still supports my overall point; you’ll need higher tolerances to prevent shorts and fires which means you need thicker casings. A user-replaceable battery has thicker battery cases and connectors compared to devices where the battery isn’t accessible.
Look at laptops for a similar story; making batteries user-inaccessible allowed them to shed thicker casings and instead fill more space when they weren’t constrained by a user compartment and casing and need for easy-detachable connector. Going back to a user-removable design in the exact same size case means slightly lower capacity batteries, which customers don’t want as a trade off.
Did you even open an iPhone? Frankly speaking, if they didn't have special screws and removed a few of the glued parts it would be more than a reasonable compromise to have to deal with their current connectors to replace a battery. The problem is that even if you have the proper screwdriver you'll have to deal with glued stuff that won't come out easily and sourcing batteries isn't easy.
"User replaceable" can be different from "open a back case with your finger and pop the battery out". I believe if Apple did something like: remove 2 phillips screws from the bottom of the phone and then the back/front comes out (without single-use adhesives) and a battery hold in place by two other screws and one more for the current power conector it would be "user replaceable" enough for most people and situations. This would be simple changes to their current design that wouldn't, most likely, require a change to the thickness of the phone nor a complete internal redesign while delivering a very huge improvement in repairability.
By your standard then, Apple already has user-replaceable batteries.
If it requires a pile of proprietary and special hardware, custom made screw drivers and extras al shipped to you it isn't my definition of user-replaceable. And me remind you that whatever Apple is providing now was the result of the effort of multiple people pressuring the US govt. to get something, not their first approach.
Now you’re moving the goalposts. Apple gives users the same tools to open the case and swap the battery that they give to their own stores, and predictably people still complain regardless.
Dude, Apple uses pull-tabs; their batteries aren’t practically fused to the phone’s chassis like Samsung’s.
This isn’t Reddit, we are actually nice to one another here rather than make stupid taunts.
Sigh, again it’s amazing how non-engineers assume this must be so easy and they’re condescending to boot. The iPhone 14 pro has a much bigger battery than the Samsung Galaxy S5, which was a benefit of miniaturizing other hardware and removing other circuits. Apple could make a phone with removable battery but then you’re talking about going back to a 2014 sized battery with hours shorter battery life. Basically erasing all the gains of the last 9 years. You think Apple should go and build a removable battery anyway and give up their lead and stay behind Samsung, who isn’t making battery swappable phones?
I know you think Apple is being intentionally sadistic and making phones of this design just to piss you off, but surveys show almost nobody swapped their phone batteries. Apple found an engineering advantage. And since you’re being a jerk on Lemmy, blocked.
I don’t even get why a removable backplate is necessary when the battery is a ‘once every 2 years’ replacement. Why would I want my phone’s entire design to be compromised for a replacement that my phone will probably only see twice, maybe thrice?
Plus, hot-swappable batteries would carry the risk of people replacing batteries and just tossing away the spare like garbage. At least now, the procedure is restricted to businesses and people who probably have enough sense to recycle the battery.
Lol want a picture of my electronics system engineering degree?
Want my CV that includes 7 years working for an electric motor engineering and automation company/firm and 6 years experience with professional electronics repair?
Need a reference to my last employer, who i setup/managed to be the first authorised Apple repair partner in province?
Although outdated would you like my previous certifications from Samsung, HTC, and LG for electronics repair?
I'll provide my engineering credentials as soon as you do as well. Seeing thats your major claim here little man.
Keep sighing and shilling for a multi-billion dollar compnay that employs top level engineers and designers, who rather cut cost in manufactoring to skirt laws and consumer ease of repairability?
And just to add, i think all manufacturers should have easily swapable batteries in their mobile devices.
Fuck outta here with your bullshit assumptions.
Which Samsung phones with replacable batteries caught fire? Picture unrelated.
Hey, I never said it was easy, I just said that if Apple applied 35% of the engineering effort they apply into creating vendor lock-in, part serialization and other twisted anti-consumer "solutions" they would be able to accomplish it.
No, it can't be done. The iPhone is as thin as it is because the battery cover is glued to the battery. Take away the glue and it just can't be that thin (or at least, if it was that thin it would be too weak - you'd probably snap the logic board by just putting it in a pocket - sometimes phones get pressed against your leg and legs are round).