this post was submitted on 30 Oct 2024
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expect vague answers or examples of individual clueless tankies used to justify the bans of entire instances at best.
defederating & banning from tankies is popular on the lemmyverse and they're making the decision of whom you can & can't talk to on your behalf; whether or not you asked them for it.
if you care about your agency on this social media platform; try switching or joining another instance that treats you like an adult that can make your own decisions.
pick one that doesn't defederate and their attempts to decide on your behalf will become self defeating and you'll still be able to participate here.
Wah wah we were relentlessly mean to people and now they don't want to talk to us
This is a bad take. Server admins have the final say on who they federate with. I prefer to be on an instance that bans tankies and other poorly moderated instances. Heck, I support defederating with lemmy.ml because it's users seem to be confused about what freedom is.
no one's arguing that they can't make up their own rules.
also let people on other instances believe whatever they want; it has no bearing on you and you can block them and entire instances for yourself if you need to.
i don't want power tripping mods/admins or suppressive policies to make that decision for me; that's why so many people and I left reddit; i'm an adult who can make up my own mind and the lemmyverse already has the tools to empower me to do so.
this isn't reddit or a walled garden; in the fediverse it's the vegetables section of a community garden that was designed to maximize cross pollination and defederation episodes like this are like trying to install a permeable gate that don't stop that cross pollination.
The concept of defederation is literally the single most important core feature differentiating the Fediverse from centralized social media. I find it interesting that you feel employing it to be antithetical to the concept of federated networks.
Yes it was and its misapplication in targeting the same group repeatedly is laying bare its flaws and that's why it doesn't work
If that same group would stop repeatedly evading bans and defeds then it wouldn't keep happening, but since tankies' entire existence is predicated on proselytizing to unwilling "heretics" and being as rude as they possibly can while doing it because, like the mormons, it isn't about actually getting converts it's about getting people to hate them so they can feed their persecution complex, here we are.
Hexbear is still online and available to anyone who wants to read the content so I'm confused as to what point you're trying to make. If you want users to be forced to interact with other users that's what Reddit is for.
defederation is creating bubbles with communities that have little to no activity & content and that's going to drive away more people than any tankie ever could.
Could it be that the behavior of hexbears created the bubble?
Perhaps most groups don't want to associate with fascist apologists.
To be fair hexbear is the only instance that's free from whining about hexbear.
how so?
There is a common debate on free speech in the US over of a platform should be punished for enforcing decorum on their users. Typically, it comes from the far right MAGA crowd griping when places kick them off for doing far right MAGA things, posting hateful content and persistently attacking anyone outside their bubble.
Hexbear is the tankie equivalent of something like 'truth social' or 'gab' who welcomes their type of extremists.
An individuals right to free speech does NOT meant an instance admin is compelled to amplify their message and help propagate it. This was argued over on every social media platform already and the only one to unban the extremists they banned in any quantity was after Elon took over Twitter.
Reap what you sow...
Working as designed.
Literally how it was designed! I will never understand the people who think "free speech" means everyone else has to be forced to listen to them.
you want people to leave the lemmyverse?
I want problem communities to be isolated from the larger population
defederation doesn't do this. it was mean to; but it doesn't work as it was intended.
doing so only excludes your community from the main group chat that everyone else can see, which empowers them over you in addition to creating those inactive/no-content subs for your community.
so nothing about this situation is working as designed.
and to answer your other glib comment: star trek matters to me so i don't want to see this instance wither away from lack of content. that's why i'm trying despite the toxic attempts to shoot the messenger.
Don't be on a problem instance
In another 10 to 15 years there'll be yet another user schism when LemmyTM gets legal control over openLemmy and the commercially induced enshittificattion creates yet another user base diaspora onto yet another tankie invented social network safe space and; just like our gayborhoods; the user base gentrification will price us both out and we'll both likely join the ranks of that diaspora.
I think obstinacy is going to remain in season until the election and witnessing it all happen all over again is tiring and I now I think I understand how liberals feel about tankies not voting for Kamala no matter how much you try to warn them and now it stings because we're trekies; we're better than this!!!
You can't beat the beat the tankies; they're like roaches of the capitalist system; they will outlive all of us. Every single time you kick them out of the safe space that they created for themselves it turns into shit and your willful ignorance makes everyone do this userbase migration all over again and that's goes for both the lemmyverse and the election!
Okay.
Ikr. Lol. Complaining about it didn't help things either the last time around.
One of the things I've learned from the tankies this time around is that you have to keep fighting despite the overwhelming odds because when you look at the long term view: there are clear no-no's in history and genocide is one of them.
Voting for the people actively enabling a genocide is a hard sell coming from the people who broke our own laws to enable an active one and can literally stop it at any moment but won't and I can't help presuming it's got something to do with that timetable MLKjr was referring to.
If it doesn't work then why are you still posting?
Ah, now it makes sense.
I think this community on this instance might not be the right community for you.
Anyone who wants to spool up an alt on a defederated server is welcome to do so. We suck at totalitarianism.
If I want to talk to people on a defederated instance, I can create an account on the defederated instance. Nobody has made any decision for me. You seem unhinged.
Admins having the power to decide to defederate is implied simply by being a Lemmy server. It cannot be any other way. The only "asking" that occurs in this situation is a user asking permission to sign up, create an account and use the server where the admins necessarily have that power.
Yes. That's close to what I recommended; try paying attention outside your bubble.
LOL
I did that back when .world defederated from lemmygrad!
And then I spent a week on Lemmy and had to block all the affiliated instances and user FOR MYSELF like a true ALPHA so I could actually use the website.
This election cycle really has drawn them out like sap from a maple tree, don't ya think?
Tankies. Gross.
I approve when a server defederates from instances that have a large number of bad faith actors. Like strawman arguments, "examples of clueless tankies," attempting to disguise the fact that they are as numerous as they are toxic. Like, "treated like an adult," as an adult I'd like to not read rude and childish nonsense coming out of Hexbear.
If someone would suggest an instance that excludes hexbear, lemmygrad, and .ml I would like that. Lemmy.world is 2/3, that's nice. I assume the instance is only federated with .ml because .ml has some of the bigger communities. Unfortunately the .ml admins are actively participating in delusional thinking and silencing anyone who disagrees. Sounds like deciding for you whom you can and can't talk to, but that must be totally different for some reason.
The two main instances that have all three blocked are lemmy.cafe, and dubvee.org.
Nice! Thank you.
I think Beehaw.org is. We're 2/3 as well (now). .ml has some communities/users we've removed, but largely speaking .ml users have not caused any issues on our hosted communities, and we feel exposing them to our (generally awesome) communities is the net-positive here. Honestly .world's (lack of) moderation is more actively an issue for our mods, but since they're so big and we're a niche instance we really can't afford to de-federate from them.
Originally joined ml not knowing. Looking to move but haven't really found what I'm looking for yet.
Lemm.ee and lemmy.zip are nice choices
My brother in Christ y'alls whole thing is blocking any instance that contains anybody who disagrees with your world view.
But right, its only bad when they do it and its good when you do it. 🙄
Blocking trolls, yeah, or instances that are more trolls than good faith participants. Maybe you don't see a difference between that and just different opinions because you don't know how to disagree in good faith.
🎵🎵 Hey, Hi, You're the problem It's you! 🎵🎵
EDIT: For people claiming to be the "sane" ones, y'all sure have a compulsive need to win anonymous internet arguments by digging deep through a stranger's history for anything you can use then blocking them.
Very sane. much adult.
Do even your middle school peers consider it good faith if you are deliberately substituting your own words for what was written and copy/pasting your own smug comments (https://reddthat.com/comment/14346864) trying to make people mad? It's childish, that's why people don't engage.
not different at all; they're doing the exact same thing and i think it's a testament to the fediverse's design that people with such diametrically opposed world views can exist on the same social media platform.
also, look at the toxicity being leveled at me here for my comment and coming from trekkies no less; the pot is calling the kettle black here.
consuming social media for the last 35 years or so; and ESPECIALLY with reddit; has taught me how to tolerate shit takes and high levels of toxicity and i think that's enabled me to see to how the discourse is happening in the entirety of the lemmyverse and the people who are putting themselves into a bubble through defederation are missing out, which will ultimately drive them away because it's choking off activity in the communities inside those bubbles and i think that the lack of content is going to drive away more people than any tankie ever could.
star trek matters to me and i want this instance to stick around; that's why i'm trying despite the toxicity and the bad faith arguments presented here.
You are correct that it is a requirement for all communities hosted on this instance to be actively moderated within instance principles.