I was trying to recall where I read about that. Search is terrible. Took some digging but found it here:
soloActivist
There is no public ledger for cash. There is no attack surface on the devices of yourself or the other party by which your cash transaction can be compromised. There are no electronic records to exfiltrate unless one party proactively deliberately records a transaction. And if they do, there is no non-repudiation. There is no risk that any cryptanalytic advances can later expose the whole history of all cash transactions or even a chain of cash transactions. Cash transactions leave no trace unless you do them under surveillance.
This is the thread covering it:
https://links.hackliberty.org/post/2983664
Apparently the hospital eventually agreed to the patient not using the app but demanded the patient agree to an indemnity that the hospital would not be liable if they fail to reach him quickly.
No issue there.. I cross-posted it today to the human rights community (which I did not know about at the time I wrote the post), since my question still stands.
I don’t quite recall the context I had in mind when I wrote that post 1 year ago, but Belgium (for example) has enacted a law that all suppliers must accept electronic payment. It’s not just shops or b2b situations. It all-encompassing including self-employed freelancers. Even someone who rents part of their home out must give the tenant the option to pay electronically.
Also in Belgium: employees and contractors can only accept cash payment if they happen to work in an industry where that is common. So if you’re not (e.g.) a domestic worker, receiving cash wages is generally banned. At the same time, no matter what the situation is, a cash transaction can never exceed €3k. Buying a house cannot involve 1 euro of cash, which is strictly banned from all real estate transactions.
Many water and utility companies refuse cash. So if you consider the right to housing to include a right to water and power, then those consumers are being forced to use a bank. But that’s not apparently government force.
Where is this? I think if he is in China or Europe he would already be excluded from society to some extent. But I don’t believe it would be a problem in the US (of course neglecting obscure cases like that of the Georgia attorney general).
There are so few of us without smartphones that are updated Google/Apple attached and subscribed that we should be collecting the stories of exclusion somewhere.
(edit) I take back what I said about the US. I just remembered a patient who was denied medical care in the US because he did not go to the Google Playstore to install the app of the hospital.
That link is unreachable from secure networks (tor). I can’t quite work out if you’re talking about a digital national passport, or a COVID “passport”. I suspect you mean the former.
I see no problem with border control forcing people to present a passport (or particular form thereof) if they have one. But a citizen is (or should be) absolutely entitled to enter their country, full stop. If they have no documentation at all, it would be an abuse of their rights to deny them entry on that basis. We might expect a citizen without docs to face a long inconvenient process to verify their citizenship, but it’d be a perverse injustice to deny them entry. IMO a passport should be a convenience, not a requirement.
I recall either Australia or NZ was refusing entry of their own well documented citizens if either they had COVID or were unvaccinated (I forgot which). Regardless of their COVID situation there is no good reason for denying a citizen entry. It dilutes the purpose and meaning of citizenship. Anyway, this is why I cannot be sure what passport you’re talking about.
I think the common term for “internet-izing” is #digitalTransformation. That’s the language used in the EU as they enact policy that ultimately cattle-herds people into a forced digital transformation. The quasi antithesis of that which wiser people support would be:
- right to be offline
- right to be analog
- right to unplug
I kind of favor right to be analog because it also somewhat implies a right to cash and to be unbanked.
Indeed in Netherlands I already encountered an e-receipt-only fiasco at a cafe. They forced me to order and pay by app as a cloud order (no cash.. no paper menu either). I had a degoogled phone so I could not do Playstore and their captive portal did not work on my phone anyway. So a staff member had to lend me their phone just to be able to order. Then the order was trapped in their account. The receipt becomes more important when paying by card so I can check it against the bank statement later. They had no printer. Only e-receipts. And their app could not handle entering another email address than what the staff member already entered for their own account -- assuming I were even willing to give them a (disposable) address as I oppose feeding Google on general principle and their email provider was Google. They could not handle pulling out a notebook and writing out a receipt.
Throughout the whole fiasco the staff must have been wondering “what’s wrong with this person? How can someone be walking around in public without a recent smartphone and all the Google services?” Probably wondered if I was part of an organised crime gang.
I’m also excluded from my public library’s Wi-Fi for not carrying a subscribed SMS-capable phone to get past the captive portal. So WTF, to get wi-fi service (financed with public money) you must already be equipped with tools that are generally redundant with wi-fi to begin with. They seem to be excluding the people who would need wi-fi the most from wi-fi service.
Not sure what your point is. Monero is far more traceable than cash. Any self-respecting privacy advocate would fight against the war on cash first and foremost. Anything else is less important to fight for because it’s less private. When cash is gone, gold coins will probably be more private than Monero.
If you try bringing 100k in cash to buy a car/house, there is a good chance it’ll get seized by police.
In the US debtors are /entitled/ to pay their debts using legal tender, and mortgages are not excluded AFAIK. In the UK, you can legally pay your mortgage with legal tender.
if you use a cell phone they know what store you went into. That can be combined with other metadata to know exactly what you’re doing. Carrying cash does not fix this.
You need not carry a mobile phone. I don’t. Cash is part of that equation. If I walk into an unsurveilled shop with cash, no phone, and no loyalty card to buy liquor, how does that get pinned on me?
It could become criminal in the future to not carry a smartphone (with the direction things are going in), but that’s not yet the case in most of the world.
Right but they need our permission because they want to hold on to power. This is what Snowden covers when he talks about cover for action w.r.t. surveillance programs. They need the anti-terror excuse. They rely on it. Where does that excuse come from? This article covers it well.
It’s not that long of a read. But I thought this was a gem worth quoting here:
I should also mention he was a democrat (not relevant to the point, but noteworthy nonetheless).
This is not to dismiss what you’ve said. But the “unthinking masses uncritically accepting the convenience” will be under the influence of the idea that anti-terror justifies it. A forced-banking policy will acquire the 55-65% you mention under that premise. The convenience of electronic payment is just the lubrication that will demotivate resistance. In fact I suspect we already have a majority believing the anti-terror narrative both as justification and the effectiveness of it.