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Margaret Thatcher was a ‘visionary’ says Labour’s David Lammy (www.politico.eu)

submitted 8 months ago by Fudoshin@feddit.uk to c/uk_politics@feddit.uk

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[–] RobotToaster@mander.xyz 57 points 8 months ago (1 children)

They really are doing everything they can to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

[+] Jackthelad@lemmy.world -18 points 8 months ago (2 children)

He's not wrong though.

You can say someone was a visionary without agreeing with their vision.

[–] uienia@lemmy.world 37 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

Nah, the term is mainly used as a praise. Otherwise you would just say "delusional nutjob".

[–] steeznson@lemmy.world 7 points 8 months ago

She managed to recreate our entire country in her image. After she retired she boasted that Tony Blair was her greatest legacy.

People have understandable reservations about this but the West has been living in her and Reagan's world since they were in power.

I think it is clumsy for Lammy to phrase it this way but the case for her being a visionary is pretty compelling. Kier is making similar noises at the moment and the subtext of this is them making a soft pitch to Tory voters by implying that they will basically be New Labour if elected.

[–] HumanPenguin@feddit.uk 24 points 8 months ago (1 children)

You can. But honestly most sane people do not.

More so when you know a significant % of your audiance dislikes the vision immensely.

[–] Jackthelad@lemmy.world -5 points 8 months ago (1 children)

“You can take issue with Mrs Thatcher’s prescription, but she had a big manifesto for change and set about a course that lasted for over two decades.”

What exactly is incorrect about what he said there?

[–] HumanPenguin@feddit.uk 21 points 8 months ago (1 children)

The word visionary.

Hitler could be described in a simlar way.

But if you called him a visionary id assume rightly so that you agree with a significant % of his odeals.

[–] Jackthelad@lemmy.world -4 points 8 months ago (2 children)

If people can't understand words and how the context in which they're used makes a difference, that's not really David Lammy's fault. Besides, the only people this would likely "infuriate" are the kind of cranks that don't need an excuse to hate the Labour Party anyway.

I mean, what aspect of Lammy's career suggests that he is in any way sympathetic to the Conservative Party or to conservative ideals?

[–] HumanPenguin@feddit.uk 13 points 8 months ago

Yep. And the word visionary specifically refers to planning a future with wisdom.

So no you are incorrect. When someone uses the term visionary. They are very much suggesting they think the ideals moved towards were wise.

While it is entirly possible that David Lamy made the same mistake you have.

Criticism of his use of the word is not incorrect.

[–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 8 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Perhaps he should have chosen phrasing that was less likely to explode in his face.

For example, “Margaret Thatcher had horrible politics, but it appears she believed them. Let’s not talk about her anymore.” There, short, unambiguous, and he’d still get to mention Margaret Thatcher, which was apparently important to him.

[–] Jackthelad@lemmy.world -1 points 8 months ago (1 children)

He's making the comparison because he wants the Labour Party to have the same kind of visionary spirit as someone like Thatcher. Not to copy the politics or ideology.

This is really not difficult. But because Thatcher is mentioned, everyone has a hissy fit.

[–] cook_pass_babtridge@feddit.uk 1 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Well yeah. There are other visionaries that haven't damaged the UK as much as Thatcher, he could have mentioned them instead. But he didn't - he made the decision to call Thatcher a visionary, same as Rachel Reeves did. It's not just some arbitrary name he pulled out of a hat.

[–] Jackthelad@lemmy.world 1 points 8 months ago

Because she's the most recent example.

Everyone who came after has just been a bland Prime Minister who doesn't really want to do anything.

[–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 11 points 8 months ago (1 children)

As an American Democrat who watched that party of the left fail miserably for forty years - that’s pretty much how they did it.

Uh, good luck.

[–] Tweak@feddit.uk 3 points 8 months ago

The UK is traditionally 5 years behind the US.

[–] Emperor@feddit.uk 7 points 8 months ago

Typo of the Week: there should be an "e" at the strategy and "sionary" should be an "l".

He'll feel silly when he realises his mistake.

[–] autotldr@lemmings.world 3 points 8 months ago

This is the best summary I could come up with:

David Lammy was speaking after his colleague, Shadow Chancellor Rachel Reeves, gave a keynote speech praising the radical former Conservative prime minister.

Reeves’ words were criticized by the figures on the party’s left, who take a dim view of the Thatcher governments between 1979 and 1990 — the former PM’s legacy continues to divide opinion.

Speaking to POLITICO’s Power Play interview podcast, however, Lammy defended Reeves’s comparison with Margaret Thatcher.

But in a sign Labour is targeting former Tory voters, he added: “Margaret Thatcher was a visionary leader for the U.K; no doubt about it — that’s absolutely clear.’

In her speech, Reeves praised Thatcher for delivering “supply-side reforms” and rejecting Britain’s “managed decline.”

David Lammy also discussed the conflict in Gaza, Donald Trump and whether Labour Leader Keir Starmer should return the party whip in the Commons to former shadow Home Secretary Diane Abbott after she was suspended over an antisemitism scandal.

The original article contains 295 words, the summary contains 151 words. Saved 49%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!

[–] some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org 2 points 8 months ago

That piece of shit Ronald Reagan was a leftist. -David Lammy, prolly