this post was submitted on 28 Aug 2023

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387

Is Trump disqualified for the N.H. primary? The secretary of state is seeking legal advice (www.bostonglobe.com)

submitted 1 year ago by MicroWave@lemmy.world to c/news@lemmy.world

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“I will be asking the attorney general’s office for their input,” Secretary of State David Scanlan told the Globe. “And ultimately whatever is decided is probably going to require some judicial input.”

A debate among constitutional scholars over former president Donald Trump’s eligibility for the 2024 presidential race has reverberated through the public consciousness in recent weeks and reached the ears of New Hampshire’s top election official.

Secretary of State David Scanlan, who will oversee the first-in-the-nation presidential primary in just five months, said he’s received several letters lately that urge him to take action based on a legal theory that claims the Constitution empowers him to block Trump from the ballot.

Scanlan, a Republican, said he’s listening and will seek legal advice to ensure that his team thoroughly understands the arguments at play.

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[–] Nougat@kbin.social 128 points 1 year ago (58 children)

14th Amendment to the US Constitution, Section 3:

Section 3 Disqualification from Holding Office

No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.

This does not require judicial input. The language is clear. Trump is, along with many co-defendants, disqualified from holding any civil or military office.

[–] OldWoodFrame@lemm.ee 28 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The judicial input is on whether Trump qualifies to be included in that described group which is disqualified. The problem with the self-executing clause here is that of course the described group of people are barred but who decides who qualifies?

[–] Nougat@kbin.social 7 points 1 year ago (2 children)

That is for state officials whose duty it is to ensure that only qualified persons are on the ballot to enforce. Indeed, if those state officials refuse or neglect to enforce the US Constitution, they could be held personally responsible.

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[–] iAmTheTot@kbin.social 22 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Not until proven guilty, legally speaking, surely?

[–] Nougat@kbin.social 44 points 1 year ago (6 children)

The language specifically does not require any conviction. A conviction would make 14A S3 undeniably apply, but a lack of conviction doesn't make it not apply.

[–] iAmTheTot@kbin.social 9 points 1 year ago (2 children)

You kinda just said that it can be denied that it applies without a conviction. I think it's tenuous at best, but I'm not a lawyer. I just know that, typically, you can't say someone did a thing if it hasn't been legally proven.

[–] Nougat@kbin.social 7 points 1 year ago

If the amendment had required a conviction of some kind, that requirement would have been stated. It is not.

[–] Dkarma@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago

Sure you can. Trump is a rapist. He raped e jean Carrol with his fingers. Wasn't convicted but facts are facts.

The Jan 6th commission is enough to show he participated in an insurrection.

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[–] RoboRay@kbin.social 22 points 1 year ago

It doesn't say "convicted of...".

[–] Bipta@kbin.social 8 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I doubt they put every Confederate on trial. Still I imagine there must be some court ruling for this to be the case. IANAL but a state court may make this decision and bar him from running in their state.

[–] Blackmist@feddit.uk 20 points 1 year ago (1 children)

"But that was only an amendment and it was written so long ago!" - Somebody with the second amendment printed out and framed above their gun masturbatorium.

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[–] flipht@kbin.social 15 points 1 year ago (1 children)

And his remedy is a two thirds vote qualifying him.

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[–] SnowdenHeroOfOurTime@unilem.org 10 points 1 year ago

You're absolutely right, but we live in a time where just recently poor people could have their lives DESTROYED over a joint, while on the other hand, a president can 100% knowingly tell an enormous crowd who he knows wants violence to "go to the capitol and fight fight fight" and that's somehow completely a grey area and our hands are just tied.

Somehow all the testimony that he was watching the coverage of it gleefully doesn't matter. The fact that even ignoring everything else it ought to be a crime that he didn't ask them to stop. Oh it's all just our opinion that he committed treason don't you see?

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[–] iHUNTcriminals@lemm.ee 40 points 1 year ago (38 children)

I'm in NH. We still have people out on the corner with Trump flags.

NH is the Florida of the north.

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[–] flossdaily@lemmy.world 37 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

I'm glad this is getting the attention it deserves right now, but this issue should have been front page news THE DAY Trump announced he was running.

"Donald Trump announces new bid for presidency, but may not qualify"

[–] DarkDarkHouse@lemmy.sdf.org 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The sheer number of charges against Trump now gives conservative jurists cover to make these statements. Democrats are probably happy to let the debate over qualification drag out as it hangs a cloud over the whole Republican primary process.

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[–] BombOmOm@lemmy.world 28 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Betteridge's law of headlines: Any headline that ends in a question mark can be answered by the word no.

[–] teft@startrek.website 21 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The question mark is in the middle.

[–] jballs@sh.itjust.works 8 points 1 year ago

Yeah, this isn't a click bate headline that ends in a question mark. This is a story about the steps being done to answer that question before the first primary.

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[–] randon31415@lemmy.world 9 points 1 year ago

Parties are parties. The republican party could have a squid reach for ballons with candidates names on them to choose their nominee. The only thing that the consitution disqualifies him is running in the general.

Of course, if the Republicans had a rule saying only valid candidates for general can run in the primary, then there is trouble, as he won't get disqualified until after the trial, which is after the primary.

[–] SheeEttin@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The NH AG, John Formella, seems like a party man. I would be surprised if he would agree with this argument, especially in the administration of Chris "I'm a Trump guy through and through" Sununu.

[–] radix@lemmy.world 19 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Be especially wary of Republicans who are pushing this "ineligible even without judicial input" argument. Many of them would love to rid themselves of the Trump albatross, but even more, would LOOOOVE the idea of simply declaring people ineligible with no oversight.

To most people, Trump's involvement in Jan 6 is obvious, but without a conviction, the door is wide open for people like DeSantis and his lackies to just start erasing names off the contender list with the thinnest of justifications. "Oh, Biden supports the Paris Climate Accords. He doesn't believe in American sovereignty, which is tantamount to treason, therefore he won't be on the Florida ballot in 2024."

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