this post was submitted on 03 Nov 2023
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“No one is looking at us or the extent of this disaster or the crimes that we are experiencing in Gaza,” he said. Still holding his microphone, he slid off his flak jacket marked with the word PRESS and unstrapped his helmet.

“These protection jackets and helmets don't protect us,” he said, flinging the equipment to the ground. “Nothing protects journalists. ... We lose our lives for no reason.”

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[–] medgremlin@lemmy.sdf.org 0 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

They took power illegally years before the literal majority of Gaza citizens were even born.

Edit: My apologies, the ones that are almost legal adults would have been infants or toddlers at the time Hamas seized power. They really should have done something about that while they were learning how to walk and speak. /s

[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Okay, and? I'm sorry, my dude, but Hamas won the election before they illegally seized power, and it's not like the people of Gaza have tried to do anything about that. Who is supposed to do it for them?

Yeah, it sucks that sometimes the citizens of a nation pay the price for the actions of their leaders. But who else can change their leaders for them?

[–] medgremlin@lemmy.sdf.org 0 points 10 months ago (1 children)

You're talking about a population with extremely limited resources that is literally 50% (or more) children that has been under two fascist boots for the last decade and a half. There does come a point where a level of desperation combined with a possibility of a better future will instigate a revolution, but right now? They don't see a possibility of a better future. With Israel's Likud on the other side of the wall and no resources to rebuild after a coup, what's the point in gambling everything on maybe being able to overthrow the more local oppression?

Also, education in Gaza is very inconsistent and most political revolutions are started by people with education and nothing to lose.

[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Okay? What, am I supposed to say that the people supporting genocidal lunatics aren't doing that because they have a shitload of kids? How does that change jack or shit?

Or do you think Israel shouldn't defend themselves because the people relentlessly attacking them have a bunch of children? What is the path towards Hamas no longer launching rockets and attacks at Israel?

[–] TinyPizza@kbin.social 0 points 10 months ago (1 children)

How many kids did "those" genocidal lunatics kill?

[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Hundreds. One would be too many, as they are perpetrated by the official government of Gaza.

[–] medgremlin@lemmy.sdf.org 0 points 10 months ago (1 children)

So how many is "too many" for Israel to have killed? Or do the citizens of Gaza not count the same way Israelis do?

[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Well, since Israel is the party which is defending itself, they have the right to go after Hamas. And since Hamas hides among civilians, if the civilians of Gaza get tired of falling victim to collateral damage, they should talk to Hamas about it.

[–] medgremlin@lemmy.sdf.org 0 points 10 months ago (1 children)

That's not answering my question. How many Palestinian lives is too many?

[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 10 months ago (1 children)

That's a question only Hamas can answer

[–] medgremlin@lemmy.sdf.org 0 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Why does Hamas have insights into your personal opinions and beliefs?

[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 10 months ago (1 children)

They're the ones with control over the course of the war and how long it will take before it ends. They are the ones who control how many Palestinians die, at least until and unless Palestinians get tired of falling victim to the violence Hamas inflicts on them and does something about them.

[–] medgremlin@lemmy.sdf.org 0 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

I'm asking about your opinion. If Hamas refuses to cooperate, how many Palestinians does the IDF have to kill for it to be too many in your mind? When does the mass murder of Palestinian civilians exceed a reasonable metric for "defense"?

[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -1 points 10 months ago

Well, I would say as few as reasonably possible to eliminate Hamas.

If Israel was mass murdering people, this would be very, very different. We don't know how many people have died, but we do know that Israel has been taking significant steps to avoid collateral damage, and we know that has been frustrated by war crimes perpetrated by Hamas (using ambulances as military transport, using hospitals as military bases, shooting civilians who try to leave the conflict zone) so I'm not sure what you want for me.

I want Israel to take reasonable actions to limit civilian casualties while they prosecute the war against Hamas which Hamas started and is continuing. I want that war to end immediately, but I recognize it can only reasonably end with either Hamas surrendering or Hamas being degraded past the point of it being a threat.