Due to the severity of the situation and the fast flowing news cycle, we have decided to create a general megathread for discussion regarding the conflict.
Informal/Satirical news sources are not allowed on the main feed of the community but you are free to post them in this thread.
Please remember that all community and instance rules apply to this thread hence keep is civil.
apologies for the off topic, but this thread shows as 11 hours old and I only see 7 top level comments. for a major event mega thread I expected much more and I'm wondering if I'm doing Lemmy wrong somehow?
A number of top level comments are from hexbear and lemmygrad so maybe your instance has those blocked? That will affect how many comments you see.
lemmy.ca defederated from hexbear.net and lemmygrad.ml, who are driving top-level comments on here. Since you can't see the top-level comments, you also can't see any discussion below.
I opposed lemmy.ca's decision to defederated from hexbear based on the perceived behaviour of hexbear users on other instances for exactly this reason: I think an instance's role is to police the actions of users posting to that instance, not to police their users' exposure to other instances.
Lemmy version 0.19 can't come soon enough - it's going to bring more moderation tools, which should help mitigate defederation.
There's also a lack of moderators as well, which causes either overreaching or insufficient actions a lot of the time.
As a counterpoint, I don't mind the hexbear and lemmygrad posts being hidden from view. These people have no interest in good faith arguments and instead derail every post into irrelevant arguments filled with half-truths or outright disinformation.
Server instances deciding independently whether or not to defederate gives people the option to either use an instance where they won't see this garbage or one where they do. Sounds like a win-win to me.
Damn hexbear and lemmygrad really became the new "commie"
It's really shone a light on how little the West actually understands communism tbh
Y'all are talking past each other because you're operating on entirely different assumptions about what the same words mean
Yeah that's a good point lmao
Communism is when I don't have to work, and also "the West TM" bad. /s
Hexbear and Lemmygrad dont have antiwork stances? Also the US empire is the largest source of violence in the world today.
This is such an obnoxious sweeping statement.
Fair point, but it applies by and large and is the reason why they keep getting defederated just a short while after federating with the rest of Lemmy (after closing themselves off for the past 3 years).
It really doesn’t. A lot of the time they’re flippant not because they have no interest in discussion but because so many libs dismiss and sneer at their vilified and misunderstood political positions — I’ve seen people literally assume they’re Trump supporters or Putin supporters and go around saying so to anyone who asks — and it makes discussion frustrating or outright impossible. Conveying a lot of background information to someone who is hostile and not listening is difficult. So they’re flippant, and it becomes a vicious cycle.
I haven't really seen any evidence of this and worldnews gets a lot of hexbear and lemmygrad posters. It just comes off as red-scaring to me.
Well a lot of the rest of Lemmy have seen numerous examples of it which is why they keep getting defederated from instances. This being about communism is a red herring as the lemmy.ml is run by self-proclaimed communists.
Furthermore, I rarely ever see hexbear users actually discussing communism or any other economic system. Typically it's just ad hominem remarks about "the west," strawman arguments, concern trolling as if they're innocent victims, and carrying water for the Chinese and Russian governments.
NGL the users of the big instances that have defederated like .world are the majority of comments I have to delete here for overt racism, supporting genocide, etc. You can check the modlog if you dont believe me.
I'm sorry, I dont really trust the opinion of the admins of instances overflowing with calls for violence and racism.
I've seen the admins be called tankies by the same people complaining about hexbear and grad.
Yeah this comes off to me as someone who had read a bunch of their comments with no background understanding of why the US empire is the largest purveyor of violence in the world today. I cannot blame them for not having the resources or authority to educate everyone they encounter.
Thank you. All anyone needs to know about why lemmy.world defederated from hexbear is that they did it preemptively because they didn't agree with the ideology of hexbear users. This is based on the admin's own statements. It was completely unjustified.
It's being extremely heavily moderated. (Not just the defederation.) You can gather the political stance by what comments remain.
Lemmy.ml/modlog
Yeah, it's not the easiest to read because most of the censorship is "user was banned from community". Which seems to remove the comments as well.
The only comment text listed in the modlog are the truly vile ones.
Is there anywhere on Lemmy that is allowing open discussion of this? Or is the censorship high enough up that it's not possible on Lemmy?
That's what I've been looking for too, I think maybe I need to make an account somewhere that doesn't defederste from anyone with differing opinions?
It seems 'People who disagree with me are ontological evil and should be silenced' isn't the best place to get news and accurate information from.
Sometimes you remove comment and then ban the user and the comment removal hasn't had time to propagate. But yeah, the vileness you see is the ballpark for what we remove.
Can you look at this one by @Pipoca 2 hours ago? I won't paste the full text here for obvious reasons, but it seems pretty reasonable, mostly facts, and not vile at all. It just looks like a bad case of overmoderation.
mod Removed Comment - There's a few things going on.
...
reason: Bothsidesing a genocide
If I recall correctly it described a genocide primarily through the lense of a two sided religious conflict. We remove that stuff as genocide apologia.
Oh. I thought that's exactly what this was.
What are you saying?
Hence why we remove it, we don't want to promote misinfo especially directed at the target group of an ongoing genocide