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this post was submitted on 30 May 2025
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Southeast Asia out here catching strays I guess? Someone want to help me figure out why a country northeast of china sending troops to a country north of China to invade Ukraine would prompt NATO to engage in proxy war in countries south of China?
Talking about expanding NATO to include southeast Asian countries. South Korea, Phillipines, or Indonesia, not to create a random proxy war.
Is South Korea in Southeast Asia?
Because North Korea doesn't make any geopolitical moves without asking China first. They are by far their primary trade partner and arguably closest ally, with literally the only defense treaty to China out of all countries in the world.
Troops getting to Russia in order to fight alongside them in their invasion of Ukraine have to either pass through China for the shorter route, or go through the tiny 17km sliver of Russia-NK border on the far east of the Asian continent that China monitors very closely (more likely). Either way, China is giving their approval to NK for the troop movements.
Okay, but where does Southeast Asia come into any of this?
It's metaphoric. Macron is saying "if you don't stay out of our geopolitical backyard, we will become more closely involved in yours".
China is increasingly invested politically and financially throughout SEA (Vietnam, Cambodia, Bangladesh, Malaysia, and more).
Okay. Kind of gross still
More gross than China enabling North Korea to send troops to help Russia attack Ukraine?
Not even close IMO.
The same gross, there isn't an active war in Southeast Asia [but there is an active genocide in Myanmar that nobody wants to touch], so if they want to retaliate they should do it on the Korean border.
It’s naïve to think that any military action in one part of the world does not affect every other part of the world
I'm not asking about the metaphysics of war and how we're all connected in the great chain of life, I'm asking the casua belli to get Southeast Asia involved as a consequence of North Korean military action.
edit: I didn't want to doubt the intelligence of my fellow lemmings but if it's not clear North Korea is not in fucking Southeast Asia
Jesus, you really struggle with this don't you
NK isn't in Southeast Asia, but Southeast Asia is the geopolitically contested region that China cares the most about dominating (at this point in time).
Macron said "keep your dog from shitting in my yard or I'll let mine loose in yours"
Okay so, yes, launching proxy wars is back on the table?
Wouldn't it be China launching the war if they attack? France is only saying they would defend in the event China initiates. Do not try to reverse the blame here.
How does any of that justify pulling Southeast Asia into a war when the front is in Ukraine and the soldiers in question are coming out of the Korean peninsula? France doesn't own Vietnam any more.
No one said anything about pulling SEA into a war. No one said anything about Europe forcing SEA like colonizers. Shit has changed in the past few decades.
NATO is a mutual defense pact. He's just talking about setting up a similar defense pact in SEA and East Asia.
As mentioned, SEA is relevant because those nations have the potential to be China's Ukraine.
SEA is likely to be open to some kind of mutual defense pact, as China has been testing borders for a long time, especially in the South China Sea. I believe the only reason they haven't is because of smaller military, trade relations with China, and the unlikely support of East Asia. East Asia looks down on SEA. If Europe engages in more trade, offers military support, and mediates improved relations between SEA and East Asia, I think a mutual defense pact is all but given. That said, the trade and military support are a tall order.
In any case, this is basically reciprocal action. See the comment about dogs shitting in yards.