this post was submitted on 17 Nov 2024
173 points (70.0% liked)
shitposting
1633 readers
645 users here now
Rules •1. No Doxxing •2. No TikTok reposts •3. No Harassing •4. Post Gore at your own discretion, Depends if its funny or just gore to be an edgelord.
founded 3 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
And thanks to non voters you will never have a chance to get a better candidate since now free elections in america are a thing of the past. Congrats. Because you do your "both sides" garbage you destroyed any hope of improvement.
American elections were never free, and the fact that the Harris campaign failed to bring out voters is the fault of the Democrats, not the voters.
Either way, revolution was always required to actually get meaningful change.
I was about to argue how you were wrong and then saw the lemmy.ml lmao A russian bootlicker talking about free elections is too ironic for me to take serious
Russian Bootlicker? In what way? Are you just trying to invent ways to not actually deal with Leftist analysis? Go for it, try to argue against a Leftist.
I am an actual leftist. Lemmy.ml are tankies who kiss the asses of fascists like Putin and Xi
I think you need to take a step back and think for a moment. Putin and Xi exist in entirely different economic systems, Putin in a Neoliberal Capitalist economy and Xi in a Socialist Market Economy, calling both "fascist" just displays ignorance towards what makes up fascism. I recommend reading Blackshirts and Reds by Dr. Michael Parenti.
Secondly, calling yourself "an actual Leftist" and using the word "tankie" without irony is goofy. Marxism is a real branch of Leftism, Anarchism doesn't have a monopoly on Leftist politics. If you want to learn more about Marxism, I made an introductory reading list on Marxism-Leninism. It even has Blackshirts and Reds in section 1.
Thirdly, the idea that Marxists "kiss the ass" of Xi and Putin is silly. Going against the western narrative doesn't mean worshipping anything going against it.
Really, all this reads as you trying to avoid having to tackle with Leftist ideas and stay in the bubble of liberalism.
I don't understand this.
Voting is easy and a basic civic duty we are taught about in middle school, in pretty much every state, you have weeks to do it, can drop off in mail boxes, ballot boxes, in person, early, etc.
Presidential elections only happen every four years, and there are going to be very very few people who would not be aware that it's happening well in advance.
Not voting is just plain lazy, that's all. It's a responsibility that takes very little effort to do, there are multiple avenues provided to do it and you only have to do it two or three times a decade.
No one is forcing me to take a shower every morning or brush my teeth, or go to work everyday, but I do it because it's important, and my overall health and life is affected by it.
You know I'd actually like to push back on this. The people who elected trump were white, uneducated, low information voters. I don't think people who aren't interested in politics, in the political system, who don't care to look into the ideas that shape the economy, shape the policy, beyond a couple weeks every four years, I don't think those people should be voting. I think it should be their choice, but I think their choice should probably be to not vote, because in that case, their votes are going to do damage. You could see thinkpieces floating all around before the election of people talking about how higher levels of voter turnout across the board, contrary to classical thought, would help republicans this time around, rather than democrats, mostly hinging on those same kinds of low-information voters, part of the younger generation which have aged into it. Your classic 22 year old joe rogan bro voters that like free weed, but don't understand abortion rights because they're not women, and think trump will give them some sort of economic opportunity.
Me personally, I would rather those probably just admit that they have no idea what the hell is going on, and choose not to vote.
Voting is very deliberately made highly inconvenient depending on zip code, and additionally the parties are not different enough for many people to care. You get these people to vote by making it more convenient and quick, and promising popular policies like Medicare for All.
How come rural, under educated voters are able to make it out every election without problems.
I'm not going to defend people failing to do a simple task once every four years.
You have four years to prepare for the event. And there are only two states that don't offer early voting, and those states allow absentee ballots for people who won't be home, have disabilities, or would otherwise struggle to vote in person. We have more resources available than ever, it's easier than ever to vote, generally, thanks to widespread mail in voting adoption (which was demonstrated by a 6% higher turnout in 2020)
I am sure you can find excuses for people here and there who were really truly unable, but 90 million eligible voters failed to do their civic duty. Even assuming every single homeless person was unable to vote, which is unlikely, that's still 88.5 million that didn't show up, and let's take EVERY single person with a disability and assume they somehow couldn't vote, that's still 45 million people that didn't show up. And let's take EVERY single person under the poverty and assume they were unable to vote, then let's assume there is absolutely zero overlap, you still have 10+ million people who didn't show up, and that's assuming not a single of the above people voted.
Failing to prepare for something doesn't excuse you from the failure of doing it.
I hope you understand you reek of privledge with the way you talk. Rural voters have an easier time of voting, typically, because of the lower population density. In fact, urban areas are often intentionally short-staffed.
At the end of the day, people vote if they feel like it makes a difference. The fact of the matter is that it largely doesn't outside of swing states, and even in swing states the differences between the two candidates was not as high as it was in 2020, when Biden at least pretended to be progressive.
You have to take a real, systemic analysis and stop blaming individuals for broader societal problems.
I don't give a shit if I reek of anything, I give a shit about the millions of people who fail to fulfil their civic duties.
I'm blaming individuals for individually not doing their individual part.
Deciding not to vote because it 'feels' a certain way is just stupid, I don't care.
I'll add, rural people have no transit systems or infrastructure, they have to have running and maintained cars, and the ability to drive them, which would disproportionately affect disabled people and others that would have difficulty getting to physical polls.
You can continue to blame the oppressed for the system that oppresses them, and all you'll have is personal frustration and an inability to fix anything.
When you come across a problem, you must be careful to accurately identify the levers that can be pulled and the mechanisms behind the moving parts. The fact is, voter turnout is tied to ease of access to vote, and the chance for real change to come from voting. Currently, voting is difficult for millions of people, and voting doesn't enact change. You've failed to identify the source of the problem, and are blaming those downstream from the source, and as such will fail to get what you want.
Do you think all of the 90 million people who didn't vote are in such a poor position that they can't sit on their couch for 1 hour 2-3 times a decade to cast a mail in ballot?
This isn't some small marginalized group, it's nearly 40 percent of the voting population. I mean, I just think that if you can't do the bare minimum civic duty for your country because you are not excited enough for the candidate, it says a lot about your character.
And voter accessibility is easier than ever, this was demonstrated by the fact that millions of more people voted in the previous election. Mail in, drop boxes, early voting, etc are more and more available. In 2020, 72% of the votes cast were done either early, by mail, or absentee.
North Carolina, a red state, has online voting for blind or otherwise disabled people, mail in ballots, weeks of early voting, absentees voting, on site voter registration, automatic registration with the DMV, etc, had 400k MORE eligible voters and 200k less ballots cast than 2020.
Absentee ballots are mailed out months in advance, meaning you have months to mark the form and send it back.
I mean, I just fundamentally disagree, I think that people who don't vote, generally don't care, there are so many resources available, and saying that it's some individual persons (Harris) fault for 90 million people failing to do their job, is just dumb.
The actual reality, is that most people are inconsistent voters and they just can't be bothered most of the time.
The fact that you think voting only takes an hour is proof that you have a highly privledged view of elections.
Secondly, I repeat, by turning your hatred towards disaffected victims of the oppressive system we live in, rather than the perpetuants of the system and the system itself, is a lost cause. What's your goal? To get one or two more people to vote? Why not get the Democrats to actually run on popular policy, encouraging tens of millions more to vote? By failing to analyze problems correctly, you fail to come up with solutions.
Voting isn't a civic duty when your votes are meaningless.
Its easy to vote when you have the privilege (time) do it.
Many people work two or three jobs to make ends meet. Many others have kids in addition to wasting time commuting to work. In my situation, if I relied on public transport to get to work I'd waste nearly 5 additional hours per day for a total of 14 hours. That's 88% (14/16 hours) of my waking hours (assuming 8 hours of sleep in a 24 hour period) dedicated to doing something that will primarily benefit a large corporation. If I had kids and had to cook a full meal + get them ready for anything I'd have zero hours to take care of anything for myself.
The people struggling to make end meet are working harder than you can even imagine, considering this is your perspective.
It's hard to vote when you have a several week window, can do it from your house, and 4 years to prepare? I just don't see it.
To add: about 9 million people work more than one job in the us.
Assuming none of the people who work multiple jobs, whats with the other 80 million people?
This isn't some small marginalized population of people, it's almost 40 percent of the eligible voting population.
Y'all can downvote all you want, but don't act like people have no agency in their lives and don't act like their decisions aren't theirs.
13 million, source: https://www.census.gov/library/stories/2019/06/about-thirteen-million-united-states-workers-have-more-than-one-job.html
To your point though, that still doesn't add up to the nearly 89 million people who didn't vote, source: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/how-many-people-didn-t-vote-in-the-2024-election/ar-AA1uaH9n - I retract my statement as it's just a fraction of the overall picture. I'm curious what other driving factors exist. I'm not going to call it lazyness without evidence though. I need concrete studies/evidence, not just conjecture.