this post was submitted on 29 Mar 2024

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Anarchism

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Does anarchism fit with occupy? (lemmy.giftedmc.com)

submitted 7 months ago by haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com to c/anarchism@lemmy.dbzer0.com

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I have recently found myself in debates about the fedipact and corporate influence. The fact that fedipact exists and I had the counter arguments and participants handy, was great. But there is more evil out there, mostly hierarchical thinking (up to speciecism imo) which leads to consumerism, destruction of our climate and more.

Imo, the rise of corporate control and surveilance (-capitalism) gives both power to autocracy (bc corporations are autocracies which influence people around them into thinking its fine) and facilitates loss of empathy for fellow humans and other living creatures.

So I began searching if there is a movement which is just anti corporate. The only one I found was occupy but it hasnt made any news for years. No big deal I thought since it has been around since 1920 so it might come back.

The wikipedia article shows occupy as having no hierarchical structure so it reminded me of anarchism in a way. Since my last post over in .ml was deleted by a mod, I hope I have shown why this is in fact an anarchism topic.

Feel free to disagree or elaborate, I'm here to learn.

Thanks for reading and have a good one.

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[–] punkisundead@slrpnk.net 8 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Occupy is probably pretty close to a popular movement that many anarchists dream about. I never participated but from what I heard / read it seems your judgement seems to spot on.

I think its important to point out, that even if a movement tries to put some anarchist ideals into practices, the goals often are not in line with anarchist ideals. Also more often than not, its really hard to have no hierarchies in a broader movement. Privilege and unspoken hierarchies around knowledge, skill and connections still exist and sometimes get really highlighted in supposedly "non hierarchical" environments.

If you like reading, there a lots of anarchist perspectives and shared experiences on the occupy movement in the anarchist library.

[–] haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com 3 points 7 months ago

Thank you for this nice and elaborate comment. I will definitely check the resources out. Have a good one!

[–] DragonTypeWyvern 4 points 7 months ago

Love seeing mod drama in an anarchist space with like 12 users

[–] Luisp@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Look at what is happening in argentina right now, the amount of social movements that are forming and are active, on both protest and direct action is something that Americans have never seen in their republic history.

[–] haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com 1 points 7 months ago

I really appreciate you mentioning this. I‘ll read up about it. Thanks!

The amount of damage the US has done to their citizens, community, society and pretty much everything is staggering imo. I‘m sad for the people who live there.

[+] poVoq@slrpnk.net -8 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children)

Your post from weeks ago was ~~deleted~~ locked because it was widely off-topic for the /c/anarchism community on lemmy.ml.

That said... the occupy movement was mostly run by Anarchists and even a cursory glance at the sources should have told you as much. It's nice that you are interested in Anarchism, but it would be great if you spend like more than 5 seconds to learn about it before posting.

[–] haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com 9 points 7 months ago

I really dont like your tone mate. I didnt like it when you deleted my post and didnt react to my messages and I dont like it now. Your fellow moderator told me in writing that they think you made a mistake and their empathetic reaction led me to not pursue the matter of you abusing your mod power in an anarchist community. So please dont push me.

[–] Barti@lemmy.giftedmc.com 7 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

Since you’re saying yourself that Hauis question/topic does have something to do with anarchism, it is illogical and unfair to delete it.

Also, insulting another person and stating they didn’t read more than 5 seconds about anarchism makes you appear like a gatekeeper about knowledge on anarchism.

Haui is asking a legitimate question here, so he deserves argument instead of abusive rhetoric.

[–] poVoq@slrpnk.net 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

This was about a totally different question weeks ago that had literally nothing to do with Anarchism and would have better fit into the /c/showerthoughts community. And besides, it wasn't even deleted but just locked, see: https://lemmy.ml/post/12525634

[–] Barti@lemmy.giftedmc.com 3 points 7 months ago (1 children)

I misunderstood which post you referred to.

In the post you locked a few weeks ago, haui explicitly asked to be told if it is the wrong place to post his question and not shut him down. You went and shut him down immediately, telling him „c/showerthoughts“ would be the more appropriate place even though a high number of upvotes clearly indicated he was indeed correct in posting the question here. Also, haui didn’t get the chance to reply to this comment of yours because you disabled that as well and now you’re coming back at him for no reason with this kind of attitude which by the way breaks the first rule of this place („dont be shitty“) as well as your comment on his old post broke the rule nr 1 (be respectful) of your community.

[–] poVoq@slrpnk.net 0 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

Sorry, but you are missing the context of /c/anarchism@lemmy.ml being intentionally strongly moderated because of previous brigading of all sorts of trolls. And these kind of conspiracy thinking posts get a lot of up-votes on lemmy.ml all the time, that is part of the problem with that instance.

And last but not least, I wasn't being shitty. I answered their question and advised them to read up on it a bit more as it is hard to miss that the Occupy movement was mainly driven by Anarchists. The most prominent face of it that is mentioned everywhere, the late David Graeber, is probably one of the most well known contemporary Anarchists. If that is what you consider "gatekeeping" then sorry but you are being silly.

P.S.: Your post history makes it pretty clear that this is a sockpuppet account of haui, so please be honest here and argue with your main account and don't vote brigade and concern-troll with sockpuppet accounts.

[–] Barti@lemmy.giftedmc.com 3 points 7 months ago (1 children)

It's funny what is "pretty clear" to you and what isn't. Like it is clear to you that my account is Haui's alt but it's is not clear to you that you are being disrespectful. Had you checked Haui's post history it would have been obvious to you that they don't hesitate posting their views with their account. My account is my personal account and I am not Haui. They can talk for themselves.

Checking **your **post history on the other hand, it seems obvious to me that you mostly comment by giving people helpful advice but on some very few occasions you act disrespectfully. Those times only seem to concern the topic of corporate power and somebody critizing it. This in turn leads me to believe that maybe deep down you are torn between depending on huge corporations (maybe because you work for one or used to or because somebody close to you does or did or you profit from huge corporations in some other way) and having anarchist tendencies (which is my you are active here). If that is the case, you of course become offended by someone like Haui aksing questions because you are confronted with your inner dichotomy.

Whatever it may be, maybe you could ask yourself what it is that annoys you and get over personal grief and start treating people with respect. I hope you get there.

[–] poVoq@slrpnk.net -4 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

Please refrain from psychologizing in the future... you are so far off the mark it is almost funny :)

Oh and an almost dormant account on a random instance jumping in an obscure thread in a small community to support a specific argument is a sure sign of a sockpuppet account. Please stop gaslighting people here and treat them with the respect you claim they deserve.

[–] haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com 1 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children)

@BackOnMyBS@lemmy.world might be able to clear this up since both barti and I are known to him. Your suspicion is close but still false. I'm not writing as barti and I'm not telling them what to write. What else can you think of that would have a similar outcome?

[–] BackOnMyBS@lemmy.world 1 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

They're just throwing trash, telling you what your intentions are causing you to defend yourself, which is baiting you into an antagonistic argument. I would downvote and ignore. Also, remember that you can easily block anyone. I'm gonna do that rn 🙂👍

[–] haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com 2 points 7 months ago

Thanks mate! I didnt catch that right away. ❤️

[–] poVoq@slrpnk.net -2 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Fine, so even if that is true, you just admitted to vote brigading by asking your friends over to this thread and "dunk" on someone you previously had a mild disagreement with but then went on to harass other moderators and instance admins about. I think you should take a step back here and have a long deep thought about what respect means and how it applies to other people and not just to yourself.

[–] haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com 0 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Now you're twisting my words. I said you should think about other scenarios, not that I asked anyone to do anything. Mate, I dont know what axe you have to grind with me but your gaslighting and manipulation tactics dont work here. You're the one who shut down a legit question and were unresponsive to my messages (which in itself is disgusting behavior for a mod), your own fellow moderator told me you were wrong. What kind of issue do you have with being wrong and having to project your own issues on others?

In any case, I dont see us having a constructive discussion at any point in the future since you have no moral compass whatsoever. You're power tripping. I'm pulling the plug on this. Good bye.

[–] poVoq@slrpnk.net 1 points 7 months ago

Just for the record, I didn't respond because we jointly agreed as mods to de-escalate after you started harassing people in DMs and everything else you wrote above is a complete fabrication.